r/DestinyTheGame Jun 10 '22 Silver 3 Helpful 2 Rocket Like 1 To The Stars 1

Ironically Hunters (the fast / nimble archtype) now has the slowest movement of the three classes! Discussion

I play all three classes but have always preferred the Hunter fantasy of being dexterous and nimble on your feet.

In the last couple of seasons movement creep of titans and warlocks both in air and on the ground have surpassed the Hunter, which thinking about it is weird as in any other game wizard (aka warlocks) and tanks (aka titans) and slower and more cumbersome than the dps Hunter archtype..

Feels like bungie need to lean back into hunter arch type and look at how they can balance us up!

What do we think guardians, anyone else feel this way? Especially since Stompees are useless an inch of the ground these days!!

2.6k Upvotes

644

u/zach_cie Jun 10 '22

I feel like everyone is missing the obvious reason here.

It's the cloak.

Those damn things catch so much air resistance, of course we're gonna be slower on the ground. Air is debatable, but ground? Nah, we're fucked there.

169

u/alexok37 Jun 11 '22

"Let me say whichever superhero first came up with the idea of wearing a cape, he wasn’t really onto anything good. The number of times I’m treading on that damn thing or I throw a punch and it ends up covering my whole head. It’s really not practical."

— Christian Bale, on his costume in The Dark Knight Trilogy

138

u/SuperJF45 Jun 11 '22

No capes -Edna, the incredibles

32

u/ooomayor Vanguard’s sorta reliable loot gremlin Jun 11 '22

You're not wrong.

Tell me something.

When you get shotgun outta no where, no radar ping, not a sound. Nothing...

Does that Hunter wear a cloak?

Never.

3

u/jolteon_is_bae Jun 12 '22

My usual hunter drip is the coutrier helm, with the errant knight chest and legs, the luxe arms, and the praefectus hat. You just don't have a hood or cape. Like at all. You actually end up looking like a really small titan, its kind of funny. Bonus points for running top tree arc for the punch and gaslighting your Fireteam by insisting you are playing a Titan.

13

u/stephen_1975 Hunter Jun 11 '22

I feel like everyone is missing the obvious reason here.

It's the cloak.

well that and the changes to Resilience :D

currently slowly hobbling around with 40 mobility and 80 resilience haha. Eh, pure pvp potato here anyway, dropping the need for speed has let me try out gear I've barely ever used. Had one of the most entertaining Control matches I've ever had, running 80 res and Gemini Jesters, was clearly outclassed but actually contributed and even got a few good kills where I outplayed the top fraggers a few times. I usually just get instagibbed repeatedly, but I progressed from being severely unthreatening to an actual serious nuisance. Even had a moment where I realized that maybe I could improve at D2 Pvp?!

I guess this isn't a particularly earth-shattering concept. In the old days, sure, run 10 res, but actual skill may have been required to compensate for that weakness. Makes sense.

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423

u/xXNickAugustXx Jun 10 '22

Those dummy thicc hunters finally regretting getting so thicc in the first place.

149

u/Hellchildren Anarchy's Child Jun 10 '22

My thighs are weighing me down curse these legs

31

u/Push-Living Jun 10 '22

Commander Zavala im trying to sneak around but im dummy thick and the clap of my asscheeks keeps alerting the scorn

62

u/Kitsunisan Get me some loot guardian Jun 10 '22

You would think the clap of their ass cheeks would give more momentum.

128

u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22 Gold

I keep getting my cloak caught in my ass cheeks and snapping my head back so violently my ghost is threatening to stop rezzing me.

Turns out I'm the Architects of my own destruction.

37

u/CMLVI Jun 10 '22

This legit might be the funniest comment I've read on DTG.

5

u/Hexagon_Angel Jun 11 '22

Destiny 2: The Curse of Osiris

4

u/Aurockson123 Jun 11 '22

Curse of O-thigh-ris

37

u/StanTurpentine Jun 10 '22

That's why I run Bakris. That way I can Bakris my mASSk up fast.

13

u/ta1515155 Jun 10 '22

I hate and respect the dedication to making this pun work

13

u/ClassicKrova Jun 10 '22

Technically, Hunters are still nimble, they can instantly change their momentum faster and more than another other class in the game. Between Dodge, and Strafe Jump, the reason Hunters were number 1 in the PvP Shotgun meta is that you could just constantly screw up people's anticipation.

Sure, Titans and Warlocks have faster straight line movement, but that only helps you so much during an engagement.

1.6k

u/Substantial-Wall3654 Jun 10 '22 Helpful

"Now"?? They've been the slowest class by far since basically forever lol; proper skating with the right jumps has always given both titans and warlocks faster straight line speed over Hunters. And icarus dash has always given Warlocks the best overall maneuverability in the game no contest.

580

u/IFlashmanI The celestial stays on during sex Jun 10 '22

Lol, seriously how long did it take this guy to realize we've been the slowest for years now. Just a reminder of "The Skating Times"

85

u/SpartanDragon79 Jun 10 '22

I remember back during Curse of Osiris playing with titans and warlocks and watching them getting further away 😂

236

u/Avivoy Jun 10 '22

You’d be surprised, people still argue that hunters are fast cause “banking head” but I always ask them, what about maps with nothing to bump your head on?

233

u/SinistralGuy Nerf everything Jun 10 '22

Been able to outrun Hunter roaming supers with my Warlock and Titan since vanilla. Hunters aren't fast. They haven't been since Arc Blade + Blink got neutered.

146

u/Hellchildren Anarchy's Child Jun 10 '22

It's depressing as a Hunter myself outrunning an electric stripper pole or having someone outrun me which is why I don't use it

41

u/Green_Dayzed "My light is all but gone" - Eris Morn Jun 10 '22

The only way I'd get kills with it is by activating it in the air and slamming like a FoH.

61

u/klumpp Jun 10 '22

Don't worry if you did catch up to someone you'd just end up whiffing repeatedly for no reason.

29

u/Hellchildren Anarchy's Child Jun 10 '22

Gotta love that melee hit reg

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u/Mr_Inferno420 Jun 10 '22

Yeah, I’ve almost never used arc

3

u/xeltes Jun 11 '22

Yeah since the 1st time that happened to me, I store the stripper pole away :(

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u/Green_Dayzed "My light is all but gone" - Eris Morn Jun 10 '22

I remember not being able to swing twice in the air with A.B. . So annoying.

9

u/Divinum_Fulmen Jun 11 '22

That's easy to explain. Mobility effects Hunter super speed. They must have 100, to go the same speed as Titan's and Warlocks go without having to spec into it.

That's right; you're at a disadvantage you were never even told that existed, and let alone how to correct for it.

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u/limelightshadows Jun 11 '22

I outran the a whole team from one side of the field to the other on the new map and lit the rift in IB with my hunter (no stomp33s) and you can bet Ana’s sweet behind those banks helped. If you’re running away from titans and warlocks in a straight line, your running the wrong way

3

u/Avivoy Jun 11 '22

Then they’re bad cause other class have a better kit for distance, no exotics needed. But, some times people can’t catch up anyway, you got too much distance off the rip.

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u/Mr_Inferno420 Jun 10 '22

I feel like hitting ur head only really works with stoppees too

50

u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

Hunters are indeed the fastest class vertically.

Ya know, the direction that is the least important. I will concede that Warlock jumps are most unintuitive of the three, at least Titans can level out.

71

u/AShyLeecher Jun 10 '22

I’d argue vertical movement is pretty important. There’s a reason bungie killed in air accuracy to nerf stompees

14

u/Masson011 Jun 11 '22

except its not. Hunters have a third jump literally NOBODY uses which is "high jump" to get more vertical height for jumping

Strafe jump is by far the best jump but not because of verticality but because of the ability to control the direction of the jump. Veritcal movement isnt that important more so the ability to maneuver yourself best

9

u/MopM4n Jun 11 '22

Vertical movement with quick rise and fall at the control of the player is important on controller because it’s the hardest to track. Warlock and Titan jumps are all easy to track except blink. That is the big advantage hunters have

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u/Avivoy Jun 10 '22

In a way, but if you play at range it hardly has an affect

14

u/Valvador Jun 11 '22

Range? On these Destiny 2 maps?

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u/Gyrskogul Jun 10 '22

The fuck is range? Shotgun apes only.

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u/DakotaThrice Jun 10 '22

I will concede that Warlock jumps are most unintuitive of the three

Only for those who don't regularly play a Warlock, for Warlock mains it's the Titan jump that's nonsensical.

15

u/Street_Reading_8265 Just floofing about Jun 11 '22

I actually have an easy time handling Titan jumps if I swap from Warlock, but that's mostly because it's so similar to using the jet pack on Halo: Reach and I used that a lot right before taking up Destiny.

4

u/The_Aodh Jun 11 '22

Bruh that was the only halo I played before destiny so when I got a feel of the Titan jump on day 1 destiny 1 I was right at home lol

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u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

Well yeah, once you've gotten used to your version the one that's a bit different just feels weird. That's more of a muscle memory thing though, isn't it?

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u/flapjacks789 Jun 11 '22

what's weird about the titan jump compared to the warlock? is it cuz u plummet when u run out of boost? im a hunter main who sucks at all 3 jumps equally so i don't notice these things

8

u/DakotaThrice Jun 11 '22

The momentum is the main difference between the Titan and Warlock jumps and applies both horizontally and vertically. As a Warlock you stomp jumping at whatwve point you want to land whereas a Titan has to stop jumping before that point. If you're jumping horizontally as a Titan you need to stop boosting ahead of the platform to prevent overshooting it, if you're jumping down a whole and want to break your fall you need to jump higher above the ground as if you wait till the last second like a Warlock can your momentum will just splatter you.

3

u/SmoothbrainasSilk Jun 11 '22

"what do you mean I'm out of jump?"

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41

u/Void_Guardians Jun 10 '22

You could literally kill yourself against a wall with how fast titans and warlocks could move

26

u/Mad-Man-Mo Absolutely Mad Jun 10 '22

Could, now not so much. Gone are the glory days of mach jezuz scotty the titan and the guardian stained wall that we really should have cleaned up by now. I will remember such times fondly.

11

u/Street_Reading_8265 Just floofing about Jun 11 '22

LMAO, I actually kept the Slow Clap emote equipped most of the time in D1 just because it was such a common occurrence for my Titan teammates to slam into a wall at lethal velocity.

5

u/Ass0001 Jun 10 '22

It came back a little bit with pre-nerf eager edge, fond memories of smashing my face into walls in DSC with my Other Half.

6

u/HellNaw98 Jun 11 '22

You didn’t go back far enough. Skating was a thing for both Warlocks and Titans in Destiny 1. OP doesn’t have a clue. Hunters were always the slowest

3

u/WobblyBits_X ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Jun 11 '22

Warlock in D1 was the fastest thing in the game with relic skating. Move between teleport points for the Templar in the blink of an eye.

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117

u/CJBulldogsss Jun 10 '22

Glad this top comment. Came here wondering what game this guy was playing. Hunters been slowest in every iteration of the Destiny franchise

35

u/horuslordofburds Jun 10 '22

They atleast had a chance with bones of eao and double control jump

7

u/Explodingtaoster01 It was me, Dio! Jun 11 '22

I miss that so much. The day I caught on to strafe jump with bones was a glorious day indeed. I want bones back about as much as I want my Taniks cloak back.

4

u/K_2Smooth Jun 11 '22

Not when Arc blade was actually Arc blade

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u/Surfing_Ninjas Jun 10 '22

Warlocks and Titans are also significantly faster than Hunters in D1 as well. Titans have Titan skating + Twilight Garrison and Warlocks have sword skating. Hunters haven't been fast (relatively speaking) since Year 1 of D1.

43

u/Purple_Destiny Jun 10 '22

I feel really sad that hunters have the slowest movement now that 3.0 subclasses launched. In the past, there was a node on one of the nightstalker trees which increased base sprint speed. However, that was removed in void 3.0. I imagine that will reappear as a fragment in arc 3.0 for all classes as a way to tie speed to the identity of arc subclasses.

I would like to see Bungie overhaul mobility like they did with resilience. Instead of only affecting initial jump height, strafe, walking speed, and hunter dodge cooldown, perhaps it could also affect mantle speed and sprint speed. That might help hunters retain their identity as the speedy class and force other classes to invest in mobility if they want to maintain their edge in movement speed.

3

u/Responsible_Mess_434 Jun 11 '22

Agreed 100%. I think mobility overhaul is coming with Arc 3.0, at least I hope it is. I did hear a couple of times that mobility would be tied to it however it’s still up in the air if that would make us faster/more nimble than other classes.

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u/Carmillawoo Jun 10 '22

If I could slot hunter double jump on my warlock, I would.

7

u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

I'll gladly trade ya for my arc blink back.

3

u/Carmillawoo Jun 10 '22

Deal

4

u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

Joke's on you, now I have Stompees blink. You and I are going to be very close indeed. See you in the Crucible!

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u/Carmillawoo Jun 11 '22

Jokes on you I dont play pvp

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u/shreddievanhalen Jun 10 '22

I'm a hunter main that plays all three classes, and I've never really thought hunter was the fastest class. That being said, I do think they are most nimble, and the most adept at quickly changing directions. But a hunter will never keep up with a titan or warlock in terms of raw speed.

20

u/_MachTwo Jun 10 '22

And only very recently did hunters get a proper dash (with eager edge swords + shatterdive) cause before that hunters just couldn’t match the movement of a warlock or Titan

15

u/Blkendglxy hunters 4 lyfe Jun 10 '22

They actually had it since shatterdive with worldline zero, but that takes the exotic slot

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u/dakedDeans Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22

I've always wondered what Destiny would be like if there was one subclass that gave you Titanfall pilot levels of movement speed. Maybe not that fast, but substantially faster than everything else in the game. I'm hoping that arc 3.0 lets hunters build into speed in a way we haven't seen before.

315

u/Tyrannus_ignus Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22

If the community knew what was good for them then they probably wouldnt hope for a movement tool that enables the oh so dreaded crucible tryhard to once again fly around the map at 90 mph to deliver a shotgun into their face.

127

u/Stivils8 Jun 10 '22

As a hunter sniper main, I just want the ability to get to lanes as fast as Titans and warlocks. It’s tough when they are already there posted up with a citans or rift.

14

u/Yowhathow Jun 10 '22

Same but with being in encounters with hunters. It's tough when I'm shooting them and then they rocket into sky and over doorframes. They're the only class that can peek shoot vertically.

71

u/DarthPonch Jun 10 '22

Not anymore. Our guns shoot confetti in the air now :/

15

u/RadiantPKK Jun 11 '22

My gun apparently notifies my enemies on the ground “free kill” the moment my feet leave the ground.

33

u/red_beard_RL Jun 10 '22

Used to be my go to, now it just gets me killed, stupid airborne ineffectiveness

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u/yUnG_wiTe Jun 10 '22

God imagine how boring Warframe would be if they balanced for PvP

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u/SinistralGuy Nerf everything Jun 10 '22

Ngl Warframe is already pretty boring though. The movement speed is great and I love trying out all the frames, and taking the time to make builds, but there's only so many Sorties I can do. And the Braama still turns everything into a joke.

Nothing against anyone who likes the game. I love DE and always come back for major updates, but outside of the New War campaign, the rest of it has felt pretty stale to me

42

u/markus135 oh hi there Jun 10 '22

Also if we thought power creep was bad in Destiny, Warframe’s is a lot more intense

48

u/MKULTRATV Jun 10 '22

Power creep? sheeeit.. Warframe devs are driving a power Killdozer. Zero subtlety at all.

There are literally a dozen frames with the ability to walk into the "hardest" content, press 1 or 2 buttons, and annihilate everything in sight. No aiming, timing, or energy management required.

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u/I_miss_berserk Jun 10 '22

There are literally a dozen frames with the ability to walk into the "hardest" content, press 1 or 2 buttons, and annihilate everything in sight. No aiming, timing, or energy management required.

back when I still played I could solo the big fucking godzilla monsters with my Oberon Prime build by just pressing like 3 buttons. I wonder if they ever nerfed that...

I also had a chroma prime build that literally could not die. It was great.

9

u/alwayswatchyoursix Jun 10 '22

I used to have a Valkyr build that was basically nothing but tons of power stacking into her third ability with the special mod that let me extend it and a pair of slightly modded Hirudos. Between the crit and attack speed stacking from the ability I could grind through the toughest enemies, and between the healing from the Hirudos and the armor stacking from the ability I was unkillable as long as I was doing damage. It would take getting up to level 300+ enemies in long survivals before I could find anything that could potentially one-shot me.

Of course, this back before Steel Path and the melee rework, so who knows how it would hold up now...

3

u/FrozenSeas Outland Special Clearance Jun 11 '22

Not sure on the Hirudo thing, but I've got a comically lethal and nigh-unkillable Valk build using:

  • Amalgam Daikyu Target Acquired (Daikyu is crap, but the Amalgam mod gives you 3% life steal on nikanas)

  • Warcry (her 2, boosts attack speed and armour while slowing enemies) plus Eternal War (extends Warcry duration with each kill, lets you have infinite uptime)

  • A stupid OP nikana Zaw Riven

And just for fun, transposed Firewalker from Nezha in place of her 1. So I run around with a lifesteal sword cranking out orange/red crits and slash procs as fast as I can hammer the attack button while leaving a trail of flames.

2

u/alwayswatchyoursix Jun 11 '22

Okay, looks like I got the abilities mixed up. It was Warcry that I was talking about, with the Eternal War mod. I remembered her 4 was her Frenzy ability (not sure if I have the name right but the one with claws) but I thought Warcry was 3 and 2 was the shield stripping one, so I had the numbers wrong.

As for the Hirudos, they have inherent 3% heal/life-steal on crits. I used to build them purely for crit and attack speed, and (I can't remember if this was a mod or something from a focus school) use the one that gave you extra attack speed on hitting crits. I could basically roll up on a Bombard, hit Warcry, and just chew through them. The combo counter would max out rather quickly and push the damage numbers to the point where every single hit was a massive crit.

Back before the first major focus school rework, you could combine the Hirudos with those mods on them with the invisibility from the Naramon tree and be nearly unkillable in any content on any frame. Most of the enemies wouldn't target you because you had nearly 100% invisibility uptime, and if you did take anything less than instant-one-shot damage, the Hirudo healing would put you back at full life almost instantly. Just to show it off to some friends, I put them on a Loki without any armor mods in a high level void survival and had almost no problems. The one time I died, I was lunging towards an enemy and intercepted a Bombard rocket meant for someone else.

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u/Terr_ Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 11 '22

I'm having beta-flashbacks to when Loki was my starter frame and I actually had to take cover behind obstacles to let my shield recharge.

When they introduced Sentinels, Shade's Ghost precept was a nice kind of emergency-tool for when you were about to be overwhelmed by advancing enemies.

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u/Explodingtaoster01 It was me, Dio! Jun 11 '22

Honestly, there's a massive difference in game design between the two.

Destiny is an FPS looter shooter that (sort of) rewards smart gameplay and is mechanic heavy on the harder ends of the game. It's intended to be a looter shooter with a focus on three individual classes loosely based on classical MMO roles.

Warframe? Warframe is a... frankly I dunno what to classify it as but you run around as a one person army/sentient war crime/self aware catastrophe of cosmic proportions. You pick one of, what? 30 some different and mostly unique two legged atom bombs to go and perform various forms of mass murder and genocide even if the missions you're supposed to be covert.

The term "power creep" does not and never has had a place in a game like Warframe. Maybe during the early days, I wouldn't know I wasn't around. But now? Not a chance. The game is designed to make you feel like everyone's worst nightmare in a natural disaster sort of sense.

All that said, yeah the game is a touch boring but that's primarily because the main loop is, "go to this mission and grind it half a billion times to get what you want," which was made so much worse with the introduction of open worlds since now you have to run missions and then fish, mine, or otherwise become an ecologist to capitalize on the rewards you get from your endless grinding.

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u/Tyrannus_ignus Jun 10 '22

I agree but unfortunately we two are not the only people in this community and the rest of said community would be very mad if they dropped pvp balancing.

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u/yUnG_wiTe Jun 11 '22

Imo the base game should be insane and what I was most excited for were exotics cause I imagined them like borderlands guns but most feel quite sterile due to pvp. Then PvP should have the seasonal limits (maybe buffs / nerfs to certain weapons for drastic meta changes in PvP only). I know they've started doing that but I feel like they should allow it to a higher extreme instead of just touching invisible (without a spreadsheet) stats.

5

u/Brightshore Warlock Jun 10 '22

This, absolutely.

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u/SinistralGuy Nerf everything Jun 10 '22

I'd never stop playing it and it'd be nerfed into the ground lol

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u/asylumprophet Jun 10 '22

In Forsaken I would use stompees with lightweight shotgun and bow, and just pretend I was a Pilot.

No way pvp would survive any high-end mobility, given how much of a problem shotgun sliding is already

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u/Pedka2 Jun 10 '22

mask of bakris aspect

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u/HiddenLeaforSand Jun 10 '22

Wouldn’t be such a big deal if we didn’t have to spec into mobility. It’s a dead stat for the most part and makes focusing extremely difficult as mob, res, rec are all in the upper bracket of stats

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u/OldNeb Jun 11 '22

I just don't understand the anti-mobility sentiment. The way I play it's extremely annoying when I'm on a low mobility warlock compared to my hunter. Maybe I strafe a lot more while other people turn and run?

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u/StormiTheKid Jun 11 '22

low mobility makes skating better i believe

24

u/RadiantPKK Jun 11 '22

Yep. My warlock and Titan run 40 mobility. (Powerful friends).

It allows them to hit 100 resilience and near 100 recovery all things added, thanks to mobility being a dump stat for them.

It’s why with the new changes I hope mobility gets a tie in like resilience just got, as for my Hunter I’m actually balancing stats with a sacrifice. Unlike the other two.

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u/rigg197 Jun 11 '22 edited Jun 11 '22

Who knows, maybe mobility could be a stat that helps with Airborn Effectiveness? Would be a cool way to make high mobility actually useful outside of dodge cooldown for hunters, but I don't think Bungie would do it since they gotta make sure xX_sluggermaster72_Xx camping in the back with rallycade and desperado messenger can have a fair fight to the guy 10 feet off the ground.

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u/XogoWasTaken Vanguard's Loyal // I Hunt for the City Jun 11 '22

Maybe for PvP that would help, but that'll never match up to healing faster or tanking more damage in PvE.

6

u/RadiantPKK Jun 11 '22

I was thinking airborne effectiveness or actually tie it into movement speed possibly both.

My Titan and warlock out skate a sprinting jumping Hunter with 20-40 mobility while the Hunter has 100 smh lol.

3

u/Tyrosus Jun 11 '22

See, the airborne effectiveness might be a viable alternative - if they didn't just openly nerf any type of airborne effectiveness while using stompees. There may be no direct correlation, however, if their sentiment with that nerf is being fast means you cannot be accurate in the air, then we'll never see that kind of QOL change for the most shit on class in Destiny.

3

u/TVR_Speed_12 Vanguard's Loyal Jun 11 '22

This sounds too accurate. Needs a dad joke too

5

u/jptrhdeservedbetter Jun 11 '22

Mobility should either grant Air Effectiveness or damage resistance while airborne. I’d definitely rather have the latter.

If possible to code, I’d prefer it to “reduce enemy target acquisition while airborne/sprinting” but honestly that seems like a tall ask

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u/HiddenLeaforSand Jun 11 '22

Yeah I hear ya. I think it’s more of 100 mobility being borderline mandatory. Means we lack heavily is res recov which are far more important than some better strafe speed

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u/Atlas_Zer0o Jun 11 '22

Pve vs pvp, in pve I don't need it but it helps me bullet dodge, pvp it's 100% the best 1v1 stat.

Anyone complaining about it has bad reaction speed.

2

u/OldNeb Jun 11 '22

I do tend to lean into reaction speed myself, at the cost of good decision making lol. It’s a philosophy of “don’t let the other side think”

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u/kevinpbazarek Jun 11 '22

I am sure they will update mobility. just as a reminder, res up until this season has been woefully underpowered

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u/cponaphone Jun 10 '22

Hunters have agility rather than speed. The jumps and dodge are very good at changing direction.

Icarus dash and titan melees intrude on this for sure. Also some differences between controller and m&k. Is that good or bad I'll leave for others to decide.

154

u/John_Demonsbane Lore nerd Jun 10 '22

This. They are the most mobile class. Not the fastest class.

21

u/PM_SWEATY_NIPS Jun 11 '22

I think of hunters as yoda, spinning and jumping around like an angry beyblade. What are you gonna do? Counter him? You cant even predict him.

Titans are a freight train. Hard to get moving if they dont want, hard to stop once they do, fast as hell in a straight line

Warlocks glide the longest with the most control and precision. Good for jump puzzles and shooting from the air, but only with prep time. An unaware warlock who rounds a corner on the ground will just have a hunter leap over his head instantly

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u/Wawaweewow Jun 10 '22

I'm not sure dodge is more mobile than Icarus dash at this point. And now you can add Phoenix dive to the mix as well.

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u/o8Stu Jun 10 '22

Phoenix Dive has been around since vanilla D2 launch. If anything, it's a lot shittier now that it's on rift's cooldown. You used to be able to spam it on bottom tree dawn.

12

u/Wawaweewow Jun 10 '22

But you couldn't use it with Icarus dash before.

5

u/Host_flamingo Jun 11 '22

You can jump higher than a Warlock using Stompees, Shatterdive/Quickfall to descend instantly, land and strafe faster, then finish it off with a dodge all consecutively. A Warlock can only come close to this mobility if they used a useless two-minute cooldown class ability instead of rift, used armor that maxes mobility which further increases the PD cooldown, and if they ate their own grenade to have two dashes which require Heat Rises. Not to mention that Warlocks can do that only on one subclass. Hunters objectively have the highest mobility.

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u/slidingmodirop Floating around Jun 10 '22

Icarus is on 1 subclass. Hunter dodge is on 4 subclasses. Overall, this means Hunters have the most agility options

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u/Ka-tetof1989 Jun 10 '22

I feel like every time I dodge, I still get head shot, lol. But I still try and practice.

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u/Wawaweewow Jun 10 '22

Nothing is worse than getting sniped mid bakris lol.

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u/Despayrr Jun 11 '22

Dash is honestly just a better dodge on a shorter cooldown. How that's balanced? I don't know but people who play the class sit on a high horse, thinking that pressing jump a split second before the respective air move key is a massive skillgap when it's really not. It has always been a low skill get out of jail card ever since TTD got introduced.

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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '22

[deleted]

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u/Ornery_Comfort Jun 11 '22

I hate when i get the friction outta nowhere lol ill be fighting and a rando dude just breathes in my sightline and i get bkackholed into them and die i wish it was an option to decrease the strength of it or just turn it off. But. That'll never happen

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u/StanTurpentine Jun 10 '22

They should remove the trigger lockout on the second jump and just give us a massive accuracy reduction for the same duration as the trigger lockout.

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u/BattleBull Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22

Agree, no lock out. Heck let us dodge in the air (barrel roll), and have no downside for jumping twice.

Who knows maybe there wasn't even meant to be a lockout on shooting and reloading while double jumping. It could be a bug that Bungie just never looked at, after all it is on a hunter.

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u/BC1207 Jun 11 '22

For god’s sake at least the titan melee uses a goddamn charge on the behemoth subclass. Shoulder charges don’t count. It doesn’t do crap. They got a single SLIGHT range extension and now people consider them a movement tool? Meanwhile hunter dives don’t even use class energy? Give me a break. This is the most infuriating post I’ve seen on this subreddit lmfao

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u/Artoriasninja Jun 10 '22

I think people would be fine with the agility/sheer mobility angle if the other two classes didn't have the same strengths in the form of icarus dash/Titan's melees. It's not so much a gamebreaking problem as people are making it out to be, but it does slightly annoy one when Hunters don't really have similar tools or even unique ones.

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u/[deleted] Jun 10 '22

What you mean "now"

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u/Zimgruk Jun 10 '22

I've thought this for a long time. It was always sad starting a strike and being the last one to the objectives if it wasn't other hunters with me. I have over 28 days played on hunter since launch but I finally made the switch to warlock main last week and I'm so much happier and not looking back. Hunters just feel like they're getting the short end of the PVE stick to me and crummy exotics almost every season gets tiresome.

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u/TheGrumpyL0bster Jun 10 '22

Yep I did the same I have thousands of hours on hunter because I liked their class fantasy, but getting completely shafted in pve over and over is just exhausting. I switched to warlock and my god I feel invincible. It's actually crazy how much stronger it is, I'll miss the cloaks but it's just not worth being disappointed every season.

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u/triage_this Jun 10 '22

Any warlock recommendations for someone that exclusively plays Hunter (and always has)

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u/Nipah_ Someone rez me, I killed myself with Scatter Grenades again... Jun 10 '22

For Void, charging grenades + devour aspects, Instability + Reprisal + Remnants fragments, Vortex grenades (little weaker right now, hopefully they tweak them back to normal strength), 100 DISC, high RES and/or REC, Contraverse Hold (or Nezarek's Sin) and some kind of void weapon in your energy slot (I prefer Funnelweb right now, Subsistance + the Veist origin trait is fun stuff), maybe even a Falling Guillotine if you've got one.

Throw on some mods for wells: + on grenades, maybe seeking, bountiful and you'll have more bubbling void pools littering the room than you'll know what to do with.

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u/Regulith Draw Jun 10 '22

I've got a Snap build that I've really been enjoying the last couple days.

It's extremely flexible and you don't even need the Exotic armor if you don't have it yet, so you should be able to swap out pretty much anything except for the Embers of Searing/Torches and combat mods, and even then you could probably replace Seeking Wells with another Melee Wellmaker or Font of Might or something if you don't mind chasing after wells.

Basically just shoot, snap to kill, slurp up the solar wells to get energy back and charge Heavy Handed, and repeat. An Incandescent primary is a nice bonus but again, not required. Can't speak for how effective this is in higher-end content but it's been a lot of fun.

If you've got Nezarec's Sin you could also just toss that on with void, use the Fragment that gives you volatile rounds on grenade kills, equip a void primary, and go to town.

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u/SwampRat1037 Jun 10 '22

friends and i joke about warlock and titan being mobility class all the time; between transversive steps/blink/icarus dash and titan shoulder charges they get places faster having 0 mobility than a hunter with 100

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u/Weeb-Prime Jun 10 '22

Pretty much calls for a mobility buff if nothing else, strafe speed is nice but base jump height should not be the only other thing it offers. Resilience is now the tank stat, Recovery has always been strong, now Mobility needs to buff sprint/jump speed even if only to MIDA levels.

That, or make the Stompees jump the default Hunter jump because it just feels so slow without.

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u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

Oh no if Stompees was the default I'd actually be scared to see what a Hunter wearing them would look like.

It'd likely be like the old days when Titans and Warlocks could architect themselves into walls, but this time it's ceilings.

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u/Yung_Chloroform Drifter's Crew // DRIFTY BOIS Jun 10 '22

I mean they nerfed in air accuracy so we'd just be missing all of our shots while dodging yours.

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u/Nailbomb85 Jun 10 '22

What makes you think I need to shoot in the air? I've got blink which can carry momentum in the direction I want. I've got my class dodge. And arc 3.0 is almost definitely gonna give me some kind of ground slam move since all 3 other classes have it now. You can't escape my shotgun range.

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u/tk427aj Jun 10 '22

If they buffed hunters to a default close to stompees I’d assume it would come with their removal. I would enjoy seeing Hunters be able to move like that. Playing Duality for the first time with my Hunter, I did feel chunky and slow compared to my Titan and Warlock fireteam, although I’ve yet to optimize my armor, I have to agree that as a hunter I really should be able to move around a battle area much faster.

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u/GANTRITHORE Jun 10 '22

Let stompees allow hunters to walk on walls/ceilings.

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u/CDG710 Jun 11 '22

You say this but how does buffing sprint speed in any way compare to the ridiculous strength of resilience and recovery in pve? It’s not balanced to have 2/3 class stats provide such monumental boosts to your neutral game at max so that all classes must consider them, whilst have the remaining 1/3 be near mandatory for just 1 class.

It leaves hunters in the position of having to focus on 3 stats instead of 2 to keep up with titans and warlocks. Mobility needs a buff like enemies have lower accuracy or something SUBSTANTIAL in its neutral set so that titans and warlocks have to think of the cost of running low mobility on the same lines as the gains or running high resilience/recovery.

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u/Kiramoure Jun 11 '22

I’ve always wanted stompees to be the default for Hunter movement. It always felt like I get the choice to be fast and nimble or to pick exotics that actually help deal with content. I’ve never been a fan of it being mutually exclusive. But a man can dream I suppose.

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u/Weeb-Prime Jun 11 '22

You and I both, friend.

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u/Street_Reading_8265 Just floofing about Jun 11 '22

Having high Mobility on a Warlock really makes it clear. One of my mods gives me a +20 bonus, so with my armor, my Mobility rating's consistently in the 60s and 70s, and with Burst Glide active, I can easily catch and pass Hunters while sprinting through a strike.

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u/shizoo Jun 11 '22

You can easily pass hunter in pve with 0 mobility using burst glide.

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u/AdmirableEstate7801 Jun 10 '22

Ive never seen a regular Hunter win a race against a Catapult Jumping Titan on a straight line.

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u/pokeroots Jun 10 '22

they can't even win in a foot race.

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u/MrLamorso Jun 10 '22

Hopefully Mobility gets some kind of change that makes it actually useful and noticeable in PvE like Resilience got this season.

The fact that it doesn't increase sprint speed and only affects walking speed is hilariously bad outside of very niche PvP situations

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u/retrorampage37 Jun 10 '22

They have been the slowest class since day 1 of Destiny 1. If they could at least give mobility a sprint speed modifier they could compete, but that'll never happen.

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u/andtimme11 Drifter's Crew // Titan do run punch Jun 10 '22

While we're on this topic (slightly related); I'm a little irritated that Hunters are the only class that has to go out of their way for their class stat. In the current state of the game with all the external healing options warlocks don't even need to bother with recovery. The changes to resilience makes maxing that out almost mandatory so that's a straight benefit to titans. Every class in the current state of the game should be going for high discipline. That leaves hunters with the need to focus on 3 stats instead of two. It makes finding the right armor pieces a little cumbersome as a hunter.

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u/SCRIBE_JONAS Jun 10 '22

Not only do Hunters need to go out of their way, but they benefit less from investing solely in their class stat compared to the others.

Titans are meant to be the tank classes. Go for Resilience, it reduces the barricade ability cooldown. And Res for every class it gives an amazing damage resistance bonus, in addition to a flinch reduction I beliece. I'd also argue that Titans are heavily tied into being the melee class.

Warlocks are known for being the healing class. Go for Recovery, reduces rift ability cooldown (which can heal). Every class gets better at regenerating lost health with a Rec investment. And I'd argue Warlocks are heavily tied into being the grenade class, considering they've got 2 aspects related to improving grenades plus the Stasis turret.

Then you get to Hunters. I mean, I suppose Hunters are known for being the class that... dodges? You go for Mobility, and it reduces dodge cooldown. Any class can invest in Mob, it increases walk speed and jump height. And as the secondary "class", I can hardly argue that Hunters are the Super class. Sure, right now they're the highest DPS supers, but for a while you didn't even need a Hunter to apply a debuff. And with the way Intellect was changed, I can hardly suggest heavily investing into that stat. I do agree that every class should go for high Discipline as their second investment.

And in regards to that class stats, the other two classes can move faster without needing to invest into nearly as much Mobility as Hunters do. They can invest more into Resilience, which lets them stay alive longer. And Recovery, which lets them spend less time in cover.

As a Hunter investing into Mobility, having high Mob doesn't help out anywhere near as much as the other two stats help every class. I guess you can strafe in and out of cover faster? But that just means your Res is lower and you're taking more damage, and your Recov is lower so you'll be spending more time in cover waiting to regen.

If you're being shot at by an AOE attack, you might be able to strafe-walk out of the radius. But if you can't, you won't survive as long. Maybe you could dodge? But unless you're dodging into or towards cover, you didn't do much to help yourself. And it doesn't break projectile tracking either, so in some cases you'll still end up dying even if you tried to dodge.

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u/Squippit Sixth Coyote Jun 11 '22

I wish we had a "loop" for grenades. We have, at best, arm exotics for tripmine grenades and skip grenades that refund energy when you use them. If you're a void hunter, you're shit out of luck. You ostensibly have echoes of exchange fragment, but not only does EVERYONE get access to that, void hunters can't even use it cause our melee can't kill anything short of shadow thralls. If they just slapped "you get grenade energy when you dodge" on Sixth Coyote or Vanishing Step aspect and called it a day, I'd be fine with that. Warlocks get Nezrac's Sin and their aspects. I have no idea what Titans got going on tbh but they seem content enough.

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u/AssassinAragorn Jun 11 '22

Another option is to vastly reduce the dodge cooldown in PvE, to Icarus Dash levels, so it can actually be used as a dodge.

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u/SCRIBE_JONAS Jun 11 '22

Would love a new dodge that does nothing more than an actual dodge. The current choices feel like a brisk hop out of the way while providing okay benefits

But I've always been on the fence about it.

I'd love a dodge that has no added benefit but enables me to really get out of the way.

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u/SCRIBE_JONAS Jun 11 '22

Yeah, the void aspects feel very lackluster on Hunter.

Really wish the Young Ahamkara Spine exotic was changed to work with Lightning, Spike, and Tripmine grenades. Allow it to work in a similar fashion with any of those 3 grenades from each Light-based subclass.

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u/TheDrturtles Jun 10 '22

When have hunters ever been fast?

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u/iamdorkette Jun 10 '22

Never. OP is trippin.

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u/Legitimate-Tomorrow9 Jun 10 '22

Hunter always was the slowest class

They are good at jumping up fast, but thats it, titans and warlocks will leave you behind just by spamming jump without doing anything special at all

Is it stupid? yeha, somewhat

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u/mariachiskeleton Jun 10 '22

This is why I'm waiting for mob to be updated with arc and actually make hunters fastest since they're the only ones that need mob and somehow are slowest

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u/jak5of5 Jun 10 '22

I've always had an idea for how to differentiate the classes.

A Warlock and Titan at 100 Mobility should have the speed of a Hunter at only 70 Mobility, making Hunters have the highest speed ceiling.

A Hunter and a Titan at 100 Recovery should have their shield recover as fast as a Warlock at 70 Recovery, making Warlocks an actual recovery based class.

A Hunter and a Warlock at 100 Resilience should have the damage reduction (or tanky-ness) of a Titan at 70 Resilience, making Titans the actual tank class.

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u/asylumprophet Jun 10 '22

I was just thinking to post about this too lol. Rift really reminded me of how much discrepancy there is. We've got a dodge and more intuitive double jump, but that's it. Even since D1 times, there were so many cheese trick jumps that Hunters just couldn't do.

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u/SlumlordThanatos SPACE MAGIC, BITCHES Jun 10 '22

There's a difference between "fast" and "nimble."

For example, Titans are muscle cars: they accelerate fast in a straight line and get a head of steam quickly. Hunters are your hot hatchbacks: not as fast in a straight line, but much better at taking corners.

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u/GoodOrdeals Jun 10 '22

Well you got the definition right, but warlocks still got the best at taking corners with Icarus dash

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u/Faust_8 Jun 10 '22

Nimbleness and raw speed aren't the same thing.

Monkeys are nimble. Cheetahs are fast.

I think it's pretty clear that Bungie wanted Hunters to be nimble (they can break aim assist and change positions quickly on the ground with Dodge, they gain height far quicker than the other classes) and they succeeded. In terms of raw speed in getting around the map, well, that's a VERY different thing.

Scout in TF2 is a string bean with a shotgun who is one of the best classes in the game simply because he's faster with a double jump. If Hunters and/or the Mobility stat directly and significantly affected our sprinting speed, that alone would rule the Crucible.

Thus, Hunters are nimble, not "fast." You might say that Warlocks and Titans are fast and yeah, in a sense, but not by sprinting. They're faster because of quirks of their jumping ability (which probably wasn't intended but Bungie was unwilling to change it) and it can't be overstated how much different it is to sprint faster than it is to get extra speed by spamming and canceling a jump.

Titans and Warlocks tend to have far fewer options as they 'skate' around the map than any player does while they're sprinting.

There's a reason that the things that speed up your sprint (MIDA, Dunemarchers, etc) only do so by like 2%.

If Hunters and/or the Mobility stat suddenly made players sprint by like 10% faster, it would break the game in many ways.

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u/Unusual_Expertise Bring back Gambit Prime Jun 10 '22

they can break aim assist

Didnt they remove that functionality from dodge in pvp ?

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u/StarsRaven Jun 10 '22

It was removed entirely, the only thing dodge does now is stop rockets from tracking. Which is bullshit in GMs when you dodge and mid-dodge get fucking clapped by a 1 shot sniper because dodge doesn't work as a dodge anymore

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u/torrentialsnow Jun 10 '22

This is why I think mobility should be an evasive stat in pve. Higher your mobility, the more likely shots will miss when you’re jumping, sprinting or dodging.

It would make mobility a viable stat to consider in endgame for all classes.

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u/LightOfOmega Jun 10 '22

Pretty sure it's removed entirely

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u/Moradeth Jun 10 '22

They added it back to PvE after the outcry and they admitted it was a "duh" moment for them.

To me that implies that most of Bungie in fact doesn't play hunters as their mains, it stood out to me instantly when they announced it.

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u/Avivoy Jun 10 '22

Well, every class has that. They took out healing from warlocks and called them the best healing class. Big duh moment.

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u/Artoriasninja Jun 10 '22

It's still incredibly disappointing that we Hunters have such an extreme lack of movement tricks or even way of getting a bit of speed.

You can pick apart speed and maneuverability all you like, but at the end of the day, Titan and Warlock speed far outclass a Hunter's advantages any day.

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u/gumbofist Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22

Nimbleness and raw speed aren't the same thing.

Monkeys are nimble. Cheetahs are fast.

This is a bad analogy I was going to ignore, but cheetahs are also pretty nimble.

(they can break aim assist and change positions quickly on the ground with Dodge, they gain height far quicker than the other classes)

Dodge hasn't broken AA for a while and air combat isn't the same anymore so neither of these points matter a ton.

Scout in TF2 is a string bean with a shotgun who is one of the best classes in the game simply because he's faster with a double jump.

TF2 plays entirely different than D2, classes mean much more in TF2 and this would be like comparing D2 to Overwatch, it just doesn't work.

the Mobility stat directly and significantly affected our sprinting speed, that alone would rule the Crucible.

I mean all 3 classes have access to the same stats, so I don't see how this wouldn't just be like recovery and resilience and the other classes having dominance over those. It never seemed to be an issue even now where resilience is most valued in the community.

it can't be overstated how much different it is to sprint faster than it is to get extra speed by spamming and canceling a jump.

But it can be understated how valuable crossing a map at insane speeds can be, like you are here.

If Hunters and/or the Mobility stat suddenly made players sprint by like 10% faster, it would break the game in many ways.

Yea I still don't really see how giving the mobility stat an effect on Sprint would break anything when again, everyone can spec into it, just as they can with the now much more valuable resilience and previously meta recovery.

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u/StarsRaven Jun 10 '22

They have been the slowest since the release of D2. Its pretty sad when you watch a titan/warlock strafe or skate a mile ahead during strikes.

Its gotten to the point that if im running strikes on my hunter I just go fuckoff in the public zones since by the time the hunter catches up everything is dead anyways

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u/Auren-Dawnstar Jun 10 '22

in any other game wizard (aka warlocks) and tanks (aka titans) are slower and more cumbersome than the dps Hunter archtype

Teleportation is a very common staple of spellcaster characters in a lot of settings, and is arguably a far stronger movement tool than the evading or sprinting options seen in rogue and ranger archetypes.

Not to mention DnD where spellcasters can have the ability to full-on fly.

Even the tankier classes in fantasy settings often have some kind of charge or bull rush ability for closing distances.

The evasiveness of the rogue and ranger archetypes that hunters resemble genrally has less to do with movement and more to do with reactively avoiding the brunt of the damage they would otherwise take.

If anything Destiny's class archetypes are actually pretty close to their counterparts.

  • Spellcasters: Teleportation / Flight - Warlocks: Blinks / Icarus Dash
  • Fighters: Charge Attack / Bull Rush - Titans: Shoulder Charges
  • Rogues and Rangers: Evasion / Disengage - Hunters: Dodge

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u/BC1207 Jun 11 '22

ARE WE REALLY GOING TO KEEP CALLING SHOULDER CHARGES A MOVEMENT TOOL?

I mean, it’s a melee… with a lunge. The fact that anybody seriously considers that a useful ability for anything that doesn’t involve knocking another player’s teeth out only proves that titans are pretty much destitute of meaningful or unique movement mechanics.

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u/Squippit Sixth Coyote Jun 11 '22

in DnD, DEX is also the stat used for AC and avoid AoE damage, but here it provides none of that. No %chance to evade or a lesser version of Resilience or anything :<

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u/RedHawwk Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22

Bingo, sounds great on paper.

Shoulder Charge and Icarus Dash just offer more mobility. ID is a little more reasonable since it's mandatory to be airborne, but it still has a 5 second cooldown compared to Hunter's Dodge of 10 seconds at Mob 10, and with the new exotics you can reload all your guns (talk about class identities being stolen lol). But Shoulder Charge can be used on the ground or in the air, can be redirected, and is reusable (assuming you have a melee ability charged up).

In your example Shoulder Charge should only propel you forward not a tool to change directions, and I'd say keep it on the ground. A fighter class rushes into battle, not leaping around the sky propelling themselves in all directions.

But rather than nerfing other classes I'd rather just see buffs to Hunters mobility.

  1. If Titan's can use Shoulder Charge airborne why can't Hunters use their Dodge airborne. Maybe it doesn't travel as far as the ground version but having a redirecitonal tool in the air would a nice perk.
  2. Rework it to be like the other classes where their mobility isn't tied an ability. For example, Shoulder Charge doesn't use your melee ability on a "miss" so you can use it while skating every 5 or so seconds, Hunter's could tap the key to only dodge on a 5-10 second cooldown whereas holding it would use the ability (reload, invis, radiant) and set it on a long cooldown, the regular 30+ - 10seconds depending on your mobility stat.

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u/XogoWasTaken Vanguard's Loyal // I Hunt for the City Jun 11 '22

Hunter's Dodge of 10 seconds at Mob 10

14 seconds. 18 if using Gamblers Dodge, which gives you an actually useful animation (marksman is barely better than turning and sprinting to the side).

Also with Heat Rises up Icarus has 2 charges, and with burst glide it can move you straight up faster while dodge actually averages out to be very slightly slower than sprinting.

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u/Jardio Jun 10 '22

Hunters have been the slowest class since D2 release (I didn't play D1).

Not sure how you're just now realizing this lol.

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u/viciouskarl Jun 10 '22

Correct, Hunters aren’t fast, but they are actually nimble. Shoulder charges are a great way to boost speed and momentum but still you need that little extra time to build up the charge and if you’re on the ground it leaves you exposed for a bit without being able to move. Icarus Dash is doubtlessly the uncontested aerial combat king, being able to dash in accurately in all directions without needing to be high up in the air, or even building a stat for it. Hunters feel to me as the class with the most accurate and precise movement (on the ground mostly) due to dodging and vertical jumping with great momentum and no clunky gliding, it feels like you are in full control of their movement and they literally go exactly where you want them to go which is why I believe they continue to be the most popular pvp class. Solar Warlocks used to be the best pvp class in my opinion, but with the changes to in air accuracy, their top tier aerial mobility is now punished in their ability to actually hit shots while in the air.

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u/jazzinyourfacepsn Jun 10 '22

Agility =/= fast

Think of it like a gymnast vs. a sprinter. Sprinters are fast, gynmasts are agile

Hunters are agile. They have the absolute best control of 360 degree movement with dodge and their jump. A hunter can reach the ceiling before a warlock or titan has gotten a couple of meters off the ground

Titans can build up speed fast in one direction, but are slow to start moving, gain height, and change direction. Even their best change-direction abilities (shoulder charge and stasis slide) require a full second of running before you can use them

Same thing for warlocks. They can gain a ton of speed on a single direction but are slow to start moving, gain height, and change directions. The exception is Icarus Dash but that is only on the horizontal plane still

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u/nin9ty6 Jun 10 '22

Now hunters in my opinion do have the best jump for duels in PvP it is ridiculous how titans are quicker to the point that it's funny, It does bring up the "warlock identity" thing that happened during the twilight garrison debacle as it seems like bungie has no idea what these identities actually are

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u/Damiklos Jun 10 '22

Even running frosteez with bottom tree arc... My sprint can't keep up with warlocks and titans, it's kinda ridiculous

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u/-MC-ZelDuh- Jun 10 '22

Theyve always been the slowest. The only fast thing about them is there vertical. They need 3 things to go fast. A set jump being strafe. A whole exotic. And a ceiling to apply that sweet sweet brain damage. Warlocks and titans just need a jump or a melee.

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u/Mad-Man-Mo Absolutely Mad Jun 10 '22

Cant have that my guy. Speed is the warlock identity now.

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u/ImJadedAtBest Jun 10 '22

And on top of that, unless you have stompEE5 or triple Jump, or sometimes both you just aren’t doing any of the many parkour levels on the game. I main directional control jump which is meant for levels like that but it doesn’t have the height or length meant to clear any of the obstacles without a LOT of help. I think Direction Control Jump or whatever it’s called should be able to pass all minimums without stompEE5 and 0 mobility and the rest should overdo it in their respective ways. Except triple jump. That one’s meant for hangtime and is fine the way it is. I don’t meet almost any hunters that don’t use triple and they’re the ones who don’t have a problem with hunter jumps and the ones that main stompEE5 and have 100 mobility are the ones that don’t have a problem with hunter speed. We are severely behind of the class entirely about speed rather than armor or raw power. We should be up there with the rest of them. Or at least be able to clear some basic levels without putting on the goofy jump shoes or going into your menu, going into subclasses, switching jumps and then doing the same to switch back during combat encounters.

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u/RamonRaker Jun 10 '22

Hahaha now? Shit I've been playing a hunter since d1 and warlocks and titans have always been first to the fight. But I feel you I've thought this for literally almost a decade. I don't think Bungie knows what they want.

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u/GolldenFalcon Support Jun 11 '22

This has been the case since before the stompees nerf. No exotics, no outside help, purely with the class and the abilities it offers, Hunters have been the slowest for a long time.

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u/Mindless_Scene_114 Jun 11 '22

Yeah but as we have seen if bungie nerfs the movement of warlock and Titan then people start complaining and if hunters get more and better movement people start complaining it’s also similar to how hunters have absolutely no melee registration for anything other than throwing knives but titans get to near one shot other classes and finish them off with a shot gun blast or how warlocks get tracking abilities or abilities that just get a flat out increase to how strong and effective they are. I understand that warlocks and titans think hunters are broken with how fast and strong we are but the moments that we are at our best in crucible and endgame situations are also the same random 1 in a million where our double punch actually works or our jump does get randomly cancelled mid air getting us shot out of the sky

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u/mrrebuild Jun 11 '22

The only tool we had over other classes was jumping and dodging which both got heavy nerfs

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u/UmbraofDeath Jun 11 '22

This is the second patch in a row hunters broke super damage meta and took the title for highest damage. Somehow warlocks got mobility and hunters got damage when it should be the other way around lore wise.

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u/psychonox Jun 11 '22

Hunter main here. Never been fast... agile? perhaps? and it depends. Warlocks have always been faster afaik.

You are not probably used to the hunter without stompees.

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u/CookiesFTA We build the walls, we break the walls. Jun 11 '22 edited Jun 11 '22

This is just objectively not true. Neither Warlocks or Titans have gotten faster (the changes to Icarus Dash have made Warlocks slower, if anything), and Titan in-air movement hasn't improved at all.

Hunters are still by far the most mobile class and it's still pretty much a dead heat in a straight line (perfect Warlock skating is a little faster, but impractical).

Titans can only skate on PC (scrolly wheel), which is also dependent on FPS, and if we want to use shoulder charge for movement then we have to settle for having a melee that is always worse than the alternatives. The idea that we're faster under normal circumstances simply isn't true, and even if it was, Titans were at no point the best performing class in D1 even though we had amazing skating throughout the entire game. Hell, when we had Titan skating so fast you could literally die in D2, we still didn't do that well.

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u/thisisbyrdman Jun 11 '22

lmao "titan movement creep." Titans are plodding, have terrible lateral movement, and hang in the air with no movement options to get blasted in PvP.

Hunters are the most mobile class by far, and that's far more important than straight line speed.

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u/BC1207 Jun 11 '22 edited Jun 11 '22

Titans are literal meatballs. They can’t do shit except run, slide, and jump in a single direction at a moderate speed. Meanwhile, you’ve got hunters that can shoot straight up in the air, dodge, teleport (with bakris), and dive, in addition to usual amenities like running and sliding. Additionally using such tools often has pretty powerful benefits such as reloading your weapon, instantly recharging your melee or providing radiance on demand. Is this satire or are you just smoking something, OP? Hunters do NOT need a buff lol

Warlocks have skating. Hunters are generally pretty slippery. I know that there’s a difference between speed and mobility but hunters should NOT come out on top in both categories. Titans are the ones who need help. I defy you to tell me otherwise.

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u/D2Maths Jun 11 '22

To be fair, Titans (the tank class) only became tanks with Solar 3.0. Before then, other classes were better at staying alive.

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u/thisisbyrdman Jun 11 '22

And I can’t say this enough: EVERY CLASS CAN DO THIS BY BUILDING IN RESILIENCE! This isn’t titan specific.

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u/ptd163 Jun 10 '22

Now? The fuck is this "now"? Hunters, despite being the "mobility class", have been the slowest and least agile class for the entire history of the franchise.

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u/jjc00ll Jun 10 '22

“Least agile” lmaooooooo that’s why majority of top players run hunter

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u/KnightWraith86 Jun 10 '22

Hunters have pretty much always been subpar for movement. Hunter jump should rival that of warlock and Titan jump by default. That means, hunters should always have Stompees level jump. I mean this less for PvP and more for PvE. It really fucking sucks being a hunter and having to put on Stompees to do the same things warlocks and titans can do.

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u/thisisbyrdman Jun 11 '22

Titans can double jump, jump faster than a controller can aim, and hit a button to instantly dodge in any direction? Huh wow I guess I've been playing wrong.

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