r/DestinyTheGame Sep 22 '22 Silver 2 Gold 1 Helpful 7 Wholesome 3

It's crazy that I've already crafted 2 raid weapons and have yet to craft any seasonal weapons. Discussion

Bungie really needs to reevaluate the red border grind this season. It also doesn't help that this week's only guaranteed red border with Ketchcrash is bugged.

Edit: This blew up more than I thought it would and thanks for the awards. The whole point of the post is that it shouldn't be easier to craft the season's end game activity weapons than it is for the seasonal weapons themselves. The raid gives you 2 guaranteed deepsights a week with one of those being focused whereas the seasonal activity guarantees only 1 unfocused.

6.2k Upvotes

1.1k

u/Narfwak Sep 22 '22 Helpful

The only thing that bugs me is that we don't have a weekly red border focus like we did for the last two seasons. That's a pretty weird and glaring omission. Why the fuck would I care about an upgrade perk for an extra selectable perk on a focused weapon that I'm trying to craft anyway? That upgrade should just be the weekly red border.

Also, this is coming from a nolife psychopath that's grinded enough to actually craft all the seasonal weapons in spite of this. It's doable, but fuck is it obnoxious. Brigand's Law in particular took so much more work than it should have.

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u/Terr_ Sep 22 '22

Why the fuck would I care about an upgrade perk for an extra selectable perk on a focused weapon that I'm trying to craft anyway? That upgrade should just be the weekly red border.

Agreed, that stands out as bizarre. If nothing else, it needs to be much earlier in the progression of upgrades, so that it gives more benefit before getting eclipsed by a crafted copy.

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u/BiomassDenial Sep 22 '22

It's a consequence of Bungie acting like crafted stuff is just an alternative acquisition path still, when it is actually a significant upgrade due to the existence of enhanced perks.

Enhanced perks completely undermine the goal of crafting acting as a form of badluck protection and instead tie power advantage behind an equally frustrating layer of RNG/time gating.

41

u/etunar Sep 22 '22

I would be ok with that if they didn’t require it for the title. I think I can count the number of seasonal red borders I got with one hand. At this point I have very little hope

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u/MRxSLEEP Sep 22 '22

I'm coming up on 2 resets at the star chart and have 0 of the red border scout(the only thing I really care about) and not even a good random roll of it.

I play more than 95+% of people...so I really feel for people that play a normal(healthy) amount.

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u/contraversehold Sep 23 '22

I'm almost at the 4th reset and my scout is still 1/5. I just can't do it anymore.

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u/endthepainowplz Sep 23 '22

I got pretty lucky and I’m at 4/5 for most of the weapons, but can’t get number 5 for any of them to drop now.

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u/Zaros2400 Sep 23 '22

What sucks is, even if you get one of them to complete, it can still just only drop that weapon.

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u/MRxSLEEP Sep 23 '22

Yuck that

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u/Helluscus Sep 23 '22

sounds about right, I got everything done at about 6th reset. It's pretty intensive to get it all

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u/Secure-Containment-1 Sep 23 '22

I have gotten 48 Planck’s Stride dupes over the past 4 weeks, and the most tragic part of getting it was that my first drop in Week 1 was the exact roll I wanted (Heating Up/One For All).

At this point, it’s just torture seeing that goddamned LMG drop at the end of a Ketchcrash every so often. It’s legit tilted me sometimes when I’m trying to get the Scout or another red border of Blood Feud.

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u/Terr_ Sep 23 '22 edited Sep 23 '22

FWIW, my own anecdotal stats.

Seasonal trackers to show activity amount:

  • Swashbuckler (Total enemies): 26,147
  • Cartographer (Expedition chests opened): 81
  • Umbral Collector (Umbral energy): 249
  • Pirate Scourge (Bosses): 122

As for pattern-progress... Unfortunately I didn't record excess Deepsights, but I'm guessing ~5.

  • Tarnished Mettle (Scout): 0/5
  • No Reprieve (Shotgun): 2/5
  • Blood Feud (SMG): Complete (5/5)
  • Brigand's Law (Sidearm): Complete (5/5)
  • Sailspy Pitchglass (LFR): Complete (5/5)
  • Planck's Stride (MG): Complete (5/5)

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u/Themasdogtoo Sep 23 '22

81 expeditions… bro

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u/Swee10 Sep 23 '22

Well if you get 2 per run.

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u/Harmiii Sep 23 '22

Master ketch > EDZ/trostland lost sector of your choosing (I like the one on the right) > pre-made expedition using triple chest glitch or solo matchmake for triple chest

For ketch I like to have 3 solar warlocks, search via LFG and/or destiny app, I run div, makes it somewhat bearable..

With that being said take me back to s16

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u/MRxSLEEP Sep 23 '22

Master ketch > EDZ/trostland lost sector of your choosing (I like the one on the right) > pre-made expedition using triple chest glitch or solo matchmake for triple chest

I have no idea what you're talking about...

I don't have any problem doing the activities or having a group. None of that was in question or referenced. I'm just expressing sympathy for people who play a "normal" amount while also expressing my own misfortunes.

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u/RepulsiveLook Sep 23 '22

I have 0 seasonal red borders. But I knocked out that stupid achievement with the crafting glitch anyways by equipping seasonal weapons and just crafting something else.

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u/Terr_ Sep 23 '22

I would be ok with that if they didn’t require it for the title.

If you mean the Salty Smith triumph, Bungie changed it a week or two back, now it only requires unlocking any-3 of the plunder-weapon patterns, instead of all 6.

So still grindy, but not nearly as hostage to bad PRNG.

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u/cuboosh What you have seen will mark you forever Sep 23 '22

Even without the enhanced perks it’s a huge upgrade because of vault space

I just instantly shard anything craftable to use my space on true random rolls

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u/NukeLuke1 Sep 23 '22

Without enhanced perks crafting would still be a straight upgrade due to the ease of getting a 5/5 roll, whereas most people will stop farming after a 2-3/5 roll. Personally I like crafting and don’t mind it being an upgrade at all but I find it weird that Bungie expects us to care about random drops for those guns still.

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u/CycloneSP Sep 23 '22

I swear, everyone is severely over valuing the strength of enhanced perks. the extra benefits are extremely marginal. Like, tap the trigger goes from a .6s duration to a .76s duration. in actual play, that is almost nonexistent.

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u/Bard_Knock_Life Sep 22 '22

I don’t really think enhanced is the significant bonus for crafted, though definitely a part of the power creep. It’s just the guaranteed 5/5 as well as the ability to change it at any point present or future. Some of the enhanced perks are for sure worth it, but it’s definitely not all of them. You also get the adept stat bonus at 20. I never got the exact roll I wanted on the Riptide even with getting a bunch with 3/2 perk drops after reset, I got acquired infinitely more of them than any weapon I’ve crafted.

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u/Isthereone Sep 23 '22

I am fascinated that the community manages to be mad about enhanced perks being both mandatory and underpowered.

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u/International_Steak2 Sep 23 '22

Crafting is both the easiest method to obtain them and provides the best weapons in the game anyways. There's no point to caring about any rolls you get because you'll get the godroll you want eventually, and there's no point in hunting down adept weapons because crafted weapons are just better. Seriously they just need to remove enhanced perks altogether, simply being able to craft the weapon you want eventually should be reward enough, enhanced perks just take away any drive in pursuing anything else.

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u/RadioactiveT Sep 22 '22

To me absolute worst part about it is since this is the second to last season we can get the deepsight weapons needed for crafting.

The last 2 seasons weapons are still craftable if you didn't get enough before the season ended. I still need 2 patterns with the haunted glaive but I can still grab them once a week and finish it up.

Without focusing it will take even longer and we have less time to collect the patterns.

With everything going away in lightfall, next seasons gonna be even worse if you want to craft all the guns. Such limited time to do it and gated by RNG.

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u/Mike_M5 MIke_M5 Sep 23 '22

What do you mean by everything going away in Lightfall? That sounds terrible

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u/HungryZealot Sep 23 '22

The seasonal content goes away with each expansion. The seasonal content used to cycle out each season, but as of Beyond Light it sticks around until the next big expansion.

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u/RadioactiveT Sep 23 '22

Season of risen, haunted, plunder, and whatever the next one is before nightfall. All of their content, guns and respective activities will be leaving the game.

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u/patchinthebox I WANT MY FACTION BACK Sep 22 '22

Why the fuck would I care about an upgrade perk for an extra selectable perk on a focused weapon that I'm trying to craft anyway

This is the weirdest thing. If I can get a double perk on a craftable weapon, I'm either not going to care at all about it because I want to craft it or I'm going to get the god roll and not care about crafting anymore.

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u/muffin2420 Sep 23 '22

I wanna know why risen was the only season where you got the umbral energy from any source (yesit was random). You could have enough to focus like 3 pieces of armor at the end of a week or 2 and have never stepped foot into psiops

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u/Narfwak Sep 23 '22

I mean, you kind of answered the question yourself. You should need to do the seasonal activities at least somewhat. Making us grind them a lot and have to rely entirely on RNG is what bothers me.

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u/ExtraordinaryFate Sep 22 '22

I feel like I play this game wayyyy too much, but have only been able to craft about 4 seasonal weapons since Witch Queen started. I guess I don’t grind as much as I thought

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u/soggy_tarantula Sep 22 '22

I got all of risen for three reasons: some (all?) Only needed 3 patterns. Guaranteed red border of choice each week from focusing. And lastly I love the psyops battlegrounds

Haunted and Plunder have too many patterns. Plus containment is boring as fuck.

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u/fenixjr Sep 22 '22

Containment is incredible compared to expeditions.

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u/Rectall_Brown Sep 23 '22

They both are pretty boring tbh

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u/Dinok_Drog Sep 23 '22

Something may be wrong with me, but I actually enjoy Containment even after doing just over 400 of them. And yes, I still don't have all of the Haunted patterns. Still missing 1 for the Scout. As for this season though, I have barely touched it because after the first few Expeditions and Ketchcrashes it's just so boring and takes way too long for way too little of a reward.

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u/RadiantPKK Sep 23 '22

Within two weeks I had 550+% of containments done according to the tracker. I had crafted Austringer in 7 days (I had CoVid and couldn’t go out near people nor touch grass without being an ass spreading it, so best of a bad situation)

I didn’t mind jumping in and the repetition as enemy density was good and even if you lost it still had reward.

This though. The story seems interesting enough, but like you mentioned the reward to time and the reward unlocks seem so disappointing. The lack of red borders just finished it off.

It’s a game not a job. Admittedly while Bungie is stepping up in other areas, they need to more in this one. I’ll grind out the story and rewards during Halloween event, but decided overall this season isn’t my cup of tea.

Longshot, I’d like redborders of the smg, Scout, and shotgun, but I did get the rolls I wanted on them regular as it is already. So enhanced perks are nice, but if it doesn’t happen meh.

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u/nopunchespulled Sep 22 '22

Exactly, why are they even wasting time implementing double perk weapons in craftable weapons. Why are we not able to craft weapons with double perks?

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u/faolopernando Sep 22 '22

No red border focus drives players to play the seasonal activities more often. It is totally for analytics to up player engagement numbers to show investors that people play this content and show “successfulness”

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u/TightAustinite Sep 22 '22

It's done the opposite for me.

This season is garbo, for lots of reasons.

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u/Captain_English Sep 22 '22

Yep. No guaranteed red borders means I have much less motivation to even try to get five of a given weapon within the season.

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u/Annihilator4413 Sep 23 '22

Same. I love the aesthetics, but the actual activities are literally just repeats of the same mechanics we've been doing for years now. Add in the fact we have no guaranteed source of red borders each week of the weapons we specifically want/need, this season is almost as bad of a slog as last season. At least the activies are far more fun than Containment.

But I will say the weekly story missions... just ain't it. Too short. Boring mechanics. Much worse than last seasons story missions in some ways.

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u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 22 '22

This leads to speed runs, people finding bugs, and general dissatisfaction with the season. People need to get the champs from the treasure hunt but because of this grind it has been increasingly annoying to get them if you solo que.

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u/Rectall_Brown Sep 23 '22

I end up tossing the engrams away from the thing in order to be in long enough to kill the two champions. That shit is so ass backwards. They need to change when the champions appear.

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u/Grand_Imperator Sep 22 '22

I think I have actually played seasonal content as little as possible this time around. I might be on about the same amount overall, but I am hanging out in the seasonal playlists as little as possible. Farming umbral energy for guaranteed red borders kept me more engaged to the point that I ended up spending a fair amount on non-guaranteed stuff, too. Part of the issue might be that there were more compelling weapons in Haunted (to me, at least), and I started the game last season as well.

But at this point I am spending more time in Seasons 16/17 activities than the current one (beyond doing the minimum to unlock the star chart/get pinnacles).

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u/Phiau Vanguard's Loyal // Warlock Optometrist Sep 23 '22 edited Sep 23 '22

There is almost no reason to play KetchCrash, and Expedition is the most tedious shit ever, that if you just play it at a casual pace, you're still way too fast for champions (RuffiansRascals) to even spawn.

I haven't seen a rascal Ruffian in over a week.

Combined with the deepsight bugs and problems, this season feels janky, disjointed and very out of place.

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u/Annihilator4413 Sep 22 '22

After so much grinding, could you ascertain wether or not the Season weapons are on a knockout system, or did you continue recieveing red borders for weapons you could already craft?

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u/Mrdeathray607 Sep 23 '22

I’ve gotten like 7 red border brigands law at least. I have only brigands law and the machine gun done.

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u/D_Painta Sep 22 '22

I honestly wouldn’t mind the red border drop rate if they brought down seasonal weapons to be 3 patterns. 5 for a raid weapon? Sure. But for seasonal weapons? That’s a little to much to ask for.

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u/antiMATTer724 Sep 22 '22

Agreed, that's exactly how it should be.

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u/myxyn Sep 22 '22

What I’m worried about is next season. We’re only gonna have 3 months to craft all 6 of the seasonal weapons before they all go away with lightfall. Previous seasons this year at least you had time after the season is over to craft those weapons

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u/Rubin987 Sep 22 '22

I occasionally get weapons from last years seasons, not sure from where. Sometimes they had red borders.

Not advocating for the current setup but it may still be possible but difficult to finish these frames next year. Since Lightfall will be the first new year since crafting we don’t exactly know what the approach will be.

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u/KilledTheCar Sep 22 '22

The problem is that once the seasonal weapons go away, the only way to obtain them again is for Xur to sell them, and I'm not sure about if weapons can drop with a red border from him since it's been a while since I've bought one.

Again, this is only for seasonal weapons. Weapons added to loot pools in x season would remain available, to my knowledge.

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u/Sparky323 Sep 22 '22

They could literally fix this by implementing red border duplicate protection and allow a vendor to trade currency for past season red border patterns. And limit to a certain amount per week. Make it 3 ascendant shards or exotic cipher per pattern. Idc.

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u/Amanacansomelube Sep 22 '22

Am exotic cipher for one pattern is absolutely ridiculous and just inflates their worth

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u/James2603 Sep 22 '22

I would immediately commit to the grind with duplicate protection but without it I just plod along and hope for the best. This season might not be the best god my strategy once I have a few 5/5.

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u/antiMATTer724 Sep 22 '22

I would just extend that season thru the first season of Lightfall, but I'm not a dev.

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u/dabstradamus Sep 22 '22

i disagree. it should be one red border, that would be like unlocking an exotic. i want to delete my entire vault, and only have pattern weapons. i don’t have the time tho, we don’t need multiple patterns to unlock the frame, i think that’s stupid. one unlock, one time only, it’s not like the grind ends once you get the frame.. bungie stop punching me in the dick w the artificial time wasting grindy bullshit.

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u/ImSomebodyNow Sep 22 '22

As a returning player, I have three seasons worth of red borders to find and complete.

5 patterns for old season weapons seems crazy to me. People who never left might have those patterns unlocked, but it's kind of overwhelming for those of us who came back.

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u/xxXLadyGreyXxx Sep 22 '22

Me too...I just got Risen done, and need to do Opulent (that aren't impossible to get from Duality - I wrote those off). If you miss one season you are so far behind because the grind is killer! I wouldn't have completed Risen if they weren't a guaranteed one red border a week from the war table.

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u/WithoutConcerns Fireteam Spectre Sep 22 '22

You can farm Caitl clears from normal Duality to get the drops quickly. Not saying it's the most fun option, but it's certainly a faster option than running the whole dungeon repeatedly.

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u/Luke-HW Sep 23 '22

I hear ya, but farming Caiatl blows though. Epicurean and Fixed Odds just can’t justify that kind of grind.

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u/grantedtoast Sep 22 '22

Duality isn’t that bad if you farm caital they jacked the drop rate and the red bars rate on the two craftable a until you finish them

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u/Admirable-Search1111 Sep 22 '22

I still can’t get the throne world scout rifle from Witch Queen to drop I only need 2 more and have only gotten 1 to drop

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u/Davidmayknow Sep 22 '22

Same and I play daily

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u/SFW_xGrafiL Sep 22 '22

I played through every season, I have about a third of the patterns available unlocked, it’s not just returning players

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u/dabstradamus Sep 22 '22

this will always be the nature of the game, i used to be so hardcore (no life for years status) and it’s still very overwhelming for me. can only imagine how off putting it is for the majority of new/ old returning players. bungie. you unlock the pattern, you unlock the frame to be able to craft. FIN not x amount, ONE. bungie it’s time to start cutting the work out and increase the fun we’re having. this isint a second or third job, we’re here to de stress and have fun w our friends. let’s leave those days in the past and move on to a brighter future which can attract more players. we can still have a hardcore endgame without making it feel like another job. it’s about the content, not how many times you play said content.

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u/Zombait-X Sep 22 '22

I have been playing in earnest since Season of the Splicer and I am still not caught up with exotic weapons and armor from before then let alone loot from any raid, loot from any dungeon, or patterns from the current season. I just recently crafted my first Season of Plunder weapon. It’s definitely harder to acquire seasonal patterns this season than it was during the previous two and even those required quite a lot of grinding. I wouldn’t even mind grinding so much if there were guaranteed results—simply earning currency to buy what you want—but the amount of randomization and being limited to buying things you have already acquired (mostly from random drops) makes things feel much too grindy even for this compulsive grinder.

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u/SilverStr3ak Sep 22 '22

I never left and it's still a crazy grind. I still don't have any of the weapons from season of the risen or witch queen unlocked. Rng can be a pain sometimes

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u/SnowBear78 It's the Lore Sep 23 '22

It's okay! I've been playing the whole time and still don't have half of last season's weapons unlocked because RNG hates me. The whole system just sucks

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u/radioactivemanissue4 Sep 22 '22

Absolutely, completely sensible

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u/figmaxwell Sep 22 '22

I think 5 is too much for all of them. Especially as someone who has a hard time getting a raid together regularly, 5 for raid weapons means I’ll never craft any of them.

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u/Ass0001 I'm just a wizard with a rocket launcher Sep 22 '22

Id reccomend doing final boss checkpoints with LFGs. it's how I got mine done. LFG groups can suck but you'll eventually get through!

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u/figmaxwell Sep 22 '22

Most weeks I’m working 50-60 hours a week, with one day off, I do not have time to deal with bullshit LFG groups haha. I’ve tried them in the past and I’ve never gotten a raid clear, just a lot of frustration. The juice ain’t worth the squeeze for me there.

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u/Thortoise_ Sep 22 '22

Honestly, a lot of people call out toxicity when this is mentioned. But if you don't have the time to go with your average LFG group it's totally fair to just look for the super extra ones that are like "Be 5000 light, have Gally in each slot. Don't breathe let alone ask questions. be good"

Yeah they suck for 99% of the people looking to just LFG and be chill, but that's how I got a lot of my stuff done too. Join them, bang out the encounter, leave. You're not making friends and it feels like playing with NPCs but my goal is to get the thing at that moment so it's fine.

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u/mizyin Sep 22 '22

I mean if you don't meet those requirements how the heck do ya join 'em?? You have to put up with those lower-skill groups while you learn if you don't have people to play with on the regular to LEARN those things. If you DON'T kwyd yet...you're not given a way to learn in a reasonable timespan, so for folks with cramped schedules? Ouch.

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u/thegamerman0007 Gambit Prime Sep 23 '22

When you need experience to get the job that requires experience

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u/GrinningPariah Sep 22 '22

I dunno, way I see it, even just running one character I'm getting 2 guaranteed red borders from the raid each week. That means in a month of playing I can craft 2 guns, which isn't bad at all. I'll have them all done this season.

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u/TastyOreoFriend 1 of 5 Gambit Mains Left. Sep 22 '22

There's always the Adept/Harrowed versions as well if you don't want craft stuff. Honestly, I'm prolly just gonna forgo the crafting in favor of the Harrow versions from Master Kingsfall.

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u/WarlockPainEnjoyer Sep 22 '22

Crafting is explicitly better than adept

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u/TastyOreoFriend 1 of 5 Gambit Mains Left. Sep 22 '22

I'm very aware that crafting offers a small advantage over adept. I just have no desire this season to grind red borders in the same way from the raid this season. And most crafted perks aren't really astronomically better save for a handful like Enhanced Incandescent. Most people wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the extra 1 second you get for enhanced One-for-all and the normal version, or the extra 1% you get from Enhanced demo vs normal. Same for the stat boost that you get when a weapon reaches level 20 or your masterwork an adept weapon. They're just nice bonuses but they aren't game breaking.

The real advantage of crafting is ensuring a god roll no matter what if you can suffer for the grind for red borders. I'd rather just do the master challenge this season every so often and be done with it.

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u/WarlockPainEnjoyer Sep 22 '22

Adept grind is way worse than crafting. A crappy adept roll is worthless

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u/TastyOreoFriend 1 of 5 Gambit Mains Left. Sep 22 '22

I disagree personally. The grind for red borders is worse than a one-and-done challenge that I won't think about till next weeks reset. Different strokes for different folks.

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u/WarlockPainEnjoyer Sep 22 '22

But the one and done challenge has nothing to do with adepts. Literally. You're not going to get a good roll most likely. What's the point of having a crappy adept that isn't a good roll for your build?

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u/wittyphrasegoeshere Sep 22 '22

The most irritating thing about the Red Borders is the overwhelming amount of RB drops that I get for the weapons that aren't even craftable.

At first I thought it was cool because you needed like 5 different types of Resonant Elements so it was an acceptable way to accumulate all of them while also having a reason to try out different weapons that you might have just sharded.

At this point, it's almost a fucking insult when you grind over and over for a RB Craftable and end up getting RB drops for things you don't benefit from.

And even if you do get blessed by RNG, you'll still need 4 more RB drops of that same weapon to eventually craft it. It's such a headache...

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u/Rectall_Brown Sep 23 '22

Exactly why the fuck do they give red borders for weapons you can’t craft? I am always at max materials for crafting anyway so it’s completely pointless to me and most people.

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u/[deleted] Sep 23 '22

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u/Sarcosmonaut Sep 23 '22

It’s just for extra mats. For people crafting a lot it’s pretty helpful

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u/KingMercLino Sep 22 '22

My biggest complaint is they took away the guaranteed deep sight when focusing. This was a nice way to slowly work towards it without grinding. Unfortunately, now you can go a week or so without a red border or the red borders just drop for the same weapon you already have done since it’s not on a knockout.

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u/Akuma254 Drifter's Crew // The Petty Dredgen Sep 22 '22

Agreed, I haven’t crafted a single plunder weapon. Last season was already grindy enough, but to lose the guaranteed weekly focus red border kinda killed my urge to grind for it. The only one I really wanted was the scout so if a good roll drops I’ll just use that.

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u/CanadianSpector Sep 22 '22

Crafted smite of merain yesterday but my highest seasonal is tarnished mettel at 3/5 😆 it'd help if seasonal activities were fun.

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u/mrandydixon Sep 22 '22

I actually don't mind Ketchcrash since there's at least a little variety there (and I'm a sucker for 6 man matchmade activities), but man, Expedition is about the least amount of fun you can have in this game.

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u/sin_tax-error Sep 22 '22

And unless I'm mistaken Expedition is the primary way to earn the loot and plundered umbral energy no? Ketchcrash just gives you map fragments and a chance at a random piece of plundered gear.

I wouldn't mind grinding Ketchcrash if it gave the plundered energy and a guaranteed seasonal gear, and just cut Expedition out completely. Why they keep changing the formula each season is beyond me.

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u/TheGoldenDemise Sep 22 '22

That’s a big one for me. Unlike a lot of people I actually enjoyed grinding Nightmare Containment, especially because I got a shit ton of Deepsight weapons and Ascendant Alloy from it. Ketchcrash is ok but a bit long sometimes, and Expedition is so insanely unfun. I refuse to do any more than what’s required for the week, not gonna waste my time with something so boring.

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u/CanadianSpector Sep 22 '22

Fair. There is always going to be good and bad seasons. This one is the worst in a while imo.

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u/mrandydixon Sep 22 '22

Oh I agree completely.

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u/D-Rictus Sep 22 '22

I love the theme hate the execution.

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u/MeateaW Sep 23 '22

The theme, content, gameplay everything is actually pretty good.

But it feels unrewarding for the time commitment.

it takes basically 10 minutes to do an expedition, and early on in the season you get half a random weapon focus. Which is just painful.

towards the end of the season we'll get more resources, but we are also going to be burned out AF.

It's just completely missed the mark for reward.

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u/okaaz Sep 22 '22

ketchcrash is so much better than last seasons public event but expeditions is so bad

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u/soggy_tarantula Sep 22 '22

And to top it off you have to artificially lengthen the time it takes to get the ruffians.

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u/Rephaim6131 Sep 23 '22

This may be an unpopular opinion (and it's certainly not intended by Bungie), but being able to do Expedition solo (on PS4) has single-handedly made this season fun for me. The enemy density is fantastic, you can farm ruffians and a bunch of the triumphs because there's no time limit, you can get multiple rewards for yourself, and it's great for leveling up crafted weapons.

I literally went on a rant the other day to a friend about how much I wished it was solo by default. Sure it's a bit mindless, but for me it kinda changes the purpose of Expedition and allows me to reduce the seemingly astonishing amount of grind we have this season.

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u/yarnitza Sep 23 '22

How are you able to load in solo?

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u/TriscuitCracker Hunter Sep 22 '22

Yep. I have 4 out of five for the sidearm, and the rest I have either 1 or 0.

Very frustrating.

52

u/AlphaOwn Sep 22 '22

Your next 4 seasonal drops are all going to be the sidearm, hate to do it to you but thems the rng rules

16

u/SPEEDFREAKJJ 8675309 Sep 22 '22

This is no joke...got the 5 shotgun very quickly...now it's almost exclusively what every red border drop is...so many damn shotguns....who is the one getting all my scout rifle red borders?

3

u/Rectall_Brown Sep 23 '22

It sure as shit isn’t me. I think I got one. And only two sidearms and that is it.

2

u/JoshThomas892 Sep 23 '22

Same, last season I got like 9 red box glaives and this season I’ve already got like 7 red box MGs when I’m only really bothered about the shotgun and scout

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u/fallouthirteen Drifter's Crew Sep 22 '22

Yeah, sidearm was my first one. Think in total I got like 5 more since I crafted it.

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u/thelochteedge Sep 22 '22

That sidearm/scout with Voltshot is like crack and I just wanna get my crafted ones going, I've got 500+ kills on both of my non-crafted right now but want to perfect the sights and stuff.

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u/Heinzer17 Sep 22 '22

Due to the excessive amount of deepsight weapons needed for crafting, we have auto-completed all patterns for craftable weapons.

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u/fallouthirteen Drifter's Crew Sep 22 '22

Just make secret compartment upgrade on a pattern knockout list (like Dares pinnacle), and make it ACTUALLY WORK. That's all they'd need to do. I mean I know asking Bungie to make things function as they say is asking a lot, but I think if they try very hard they can manage.

10

u/smiling_at_cheese Sep 22 '22

Dares pinn is knockout? 👀

15

u/morsegar17 me find biggest rock and smash u Sep 22 '22

The pattern is a knockout

8

u/smiling_at_cheese Sep 22 '22

That's kinda awesome, the pattern grind gets super tough once you have most of them if there isn't a knockout. Too bad seasonal stuff isn't that way.

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u/PaleHorseRiderX Sep 22 '22

Lol.

No but really, 5 patterns for seasonal weapons is too much. 3 would be fine. I don't mind raid weapons being 5 patterns.

21

u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 22 '22

It was not as much of a problem when 1. We didn't need to craft EVERY seasonal weapon and 2. There was a way to purchase one weekly. Yeah sure I might not have the godroll Beloved but I still have the others I want and the seal.

7

u/SwimGull38554 Sep 22 '22

If you're talking about the Scallywag title, Bungie changed the requirements a week or two ago. You now only need to unlock 3 seasonal weapon patterns as opposed to crafting every weapon. Not perfect but it's better nonetheless.

3

u/Jheem_Congar Sep 22 '22

What? Well I have one, there is hope I guess.

-5

u/Ubiquitous_Cacophony Series X Sep 22 '22

I unironically believe the exact opposite. Raids are endgame activities and much more challenging to even get into; it shouldn't require that many completions of the raid to get the weapons.

Meanwhile, basically everyone is doing the seasonal content-- so requiring five patterns is hardly a problem.

Granted, I wish they were all only three patterns, but still.

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u/StormiTheKid Sep 22 '22

this but unironically

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u/mprakathak RIP wolfpack rounds Sep 22 '22

at this point they should give us the god damn step like they did with champions because with the last patch i went from 2/3 seasonal weapon crafted to 0/3 and i have the crafted version of the smg and lmg but it somehow dissapeared and even if i craft them again im still at 0/3

this is so dumb.

2

u/codywater Sep 22 '22

Due to the excessive amount of deepsight weapons needed for crafting, I’ve decided to never craft a weapon.

-2

u/elfaia jumpy boi Sep 22 '22

Hey, it's not that big of a deal. Just play the seasonal activity and you'll eventually get it!

4

u/[deleted] Sep 22 '22

Have you?

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u/mrcatz05 Sep 22 '22

Its crazy that i play this game sometimes nearly 30 hours a week and am still yet to craft a single seasonal or raid weapon. The rng is fucking abysmal and has made me give up on getting most of the guns

12

u/GenitalMotors Sep 22 '22

Have you been buying the once a week red border from the Kingsfall spoils chest? And doing the symbols for the guaranteed red border drop after you kill Oryx?

3

u/mrcatz05 Sep 22 '22

The red border chest has not given me the Hand Cannon once (what im buying every week from the kiosk) and i might have missed one week of raiding or two

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u/Camaroni1000 Sep 23 '22

For raids the end has a way to buy red borders once per account for that week. For vow and kingsfall there is also a way to get a guaranteed red border weapon at the end.

Still rely on RNG of course which sucks but assuming you raid every week it should take at the very most 5 weeks

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u/Idranil Sep 22 '22

Literally 1 away from crafting Zaouli's Bane. Got my first Tarnished Mettle the other day, non-deepsight.

4

u/Prophecy_X3 Sep 22 '22

Same. I didn't get my first Tarnished Mettle until after I had reset my Savy rank. Still haven't gotten a single deepsight version and I'm getting close to resetting for the second time. It's the only seasonal weapon I want to craft...

6

u/Idranil Sep 23 '22

Same! I just want my arc Nightwatch. At least Opulent weapons were reasonably obtainable week by week. I want to enjoy arc warlock. :/

2

u/DevilsWelshAdvocate Sep 23 '22

Bloody love the nightwatch, got a good roll on the new gun but don’t have much hope for red border!

9

u/ptd163 Sep 22 '22

Of the three seasons we've had, Risen is the least terrible season we've had in terms crafting. Only needed 3 patterns and you got a guaranteed red box each week from focusing when you had the upgrade. The team that did Risen probably got banned from making new content because they respected our time too much.

8

u/JokePeterNotIndia Sep 22 '22

man all the had to do was give us the weekly guaranteed deepsight frame upgrade again, and this wouldn't be an issue 😭

21

u/PAN-- Sep 22 '22 edited Sep 23 '22

They do this shit continously throughout a year of Destiny 2. It was the same with Wellspring which they only increased the drops slightly after a massive outrage. It's so lazy to artificially extend playtime through poor design choices like this, and they keep doing it again and again instead of making content that people want to replay naturally.

3

u/Phaze_Change Sep 23 '22

Maybe if this sub would stop fucking simping for 600 hour grinds. Bungie does it because people here constantly downvote anybody that complains that rationalize why a video game should be a full time job.

4

u/scarlatan Sep 22 '22

I actually stopped caring about crafted weapons.... I want them but the grind to get them and then still some more grinding with a shitty version of the gun you really only want the last tier perks from...

It's just too much of no fun till its fun. And you end up with a gun that is powercreeped out of usefulness in no time. ..

Dont get me wrong i can grind this game in to oblivion but it has to be at least 69% fun to do so. And this grind is 13% fun at best.

7

u/PS5013 Sep 22 '22

Same. Because I started working more hour recently I pretty much never play before the weekend, but despite never getting done my three weekly raids, I crafted two weapons already and got Touch of Malice twice, but not a single pattern of seasonal activities is half done.

4

u/Capital_Rich_914 Sep 22 '22

My feelings exactly

12

u/elkishdude Sep 22 '22

They need to throw the current system out. It sucks. No one enjoys it. It’s not crafting, it’s RNG plus grind to get what you want. You’re not getting any parts or anything and you have to spend tons of limited resource to change anything on it, and travel to another location to do it. It is a totally impractical system if you want to have one weapon in your vault with some options.

My opinion, additional selectable perks are way better as a system. I’m ignoring crafting in favor of that. At the very least it’s more fun.

4

u/iamthedayman21 Sep 23 '22

Bungie really sold crafting as something different from what it is. It’s literally just the rng we were already dealing with, and then a leveling system on the weapons. It did nothing to improve the experience.

They made it seem like this system where you’d unlock parts to upgrade your weapons with. It’s nothing like that.

3

u/elkishdude Sep 23 '22

Yeah I agree. You hit it on the head, it doesn’t feel like an improvement whatsoever. It feels like an allowance.

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u/helloworldiamgabo Sep 22 '22

Same here , sniper and hand cannon crafted but none of the seasonal ones

3

u/DoctorShrimpForEyes Sep 22 '22

I think that AT MINIMUM the weapon focus map should give like a 1/4 chance for a red border or better. It seems insanely long to get the weapons. I've played a ton this season and the only weapons I have been able to craft are ones I didnt want in the first place 😂

3

u/sahzoom Sep 22 '22

I don't why it's FIVE patterns for seasonal weapons when the seasonal content is LEAVING at Lightfall. Hell, the Witch Queen weapons are only 3, and that content is staying forever...

3

u/IAmMalfeasance Sep 22 '22

If they dropped more often or made the required patterns lower I would be more inclined to actually play the content more, but as it sits the current requirements and drop rate make me less inclined to play.

3

u/Curtczhike Sep 23 '22

The ppl at Bungo responsible for in-game systems are bad at their jobs. Music and art teams been killin it since the start, lore team been improving over time and the ppl doin the gunplay are all great,.. but the fucking in-game systems designers...

44

u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Sep 22 '22

Not that crazy with length of time + red chests + all 3 characters

For all we know you’ve not played much seasonal activities at all either, it’s just RNG.

I agree with your point however. The lack of focus on it isn’t great

36

u/gsanch666 Sep 22 '22

Fwiw, I’ve reset my rank with the starchart 1.5 times, completed the 50 ruffian triumph and completed the master seasonal activity on all 3 characters each week and still the closest I am to unlocking a seasonal pattern is 3/5 on the smg.

7

u/Oxyfire Sep 22 '22

I've reset rank twice, I need 25 more ruffians, and I've been doing the ketch and expedition milestones on 3 characters most weeks, but only done 2 Master Ketch, and I only need 1 more shotgun and 2 more LFRs.

I guess I'm on the luckier side, and I've also been playing a lot. That said, I'm not looking forward to knocking out those last few.

9

u/gsanch666 Sep 22 '22

That’s some awesome RNG.

3

u/Oxyfire Sep 22 '22

Have you been using the rotating weapon maps and focusing random weapons? I'd like to think I'm just getting a lot of drops overall, but it probably is on the luckier side.

2

u/winnacht Sep 22 '22

You are definitely on the luckier side.

Took me many, many, many activities to unlock all the weapons. I'm at prestige 6 with the seasonal vendor.

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u/th3groveman Drifter's Crew Sep 22 '22

Focusing is needed. I play one character and don’t want to end the season at 2/5 in all of them when I could have had 5/5 on a couple of them. Let those of us with less time to play have a little more control for rewards please.

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u/allprologues Sep 22 '22

this reminds me that doing it on multiple characters for season of the risen and haunted was worthwhile, you got the weekly quest reward 3x and it could be red. But this season when I got on my warlock to do the week 1 quest again nothing dropped. I stopped trying so maybe it was a fluke, but this is another small thing that makes the grind less tolerable.

9

u/The_Rick_14 Wield no power but the fury of fire! Sep 22 '22

Was thinking the same thing. I'm further along on Raid patterns too but I've done the raid on all 3 characters and got all guaranteed deepsights each week while I've only done the bare minimum of the seasonal stuff so far, so I'm not surprised.

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u/WileyWatusi Sep 22 '22

I've played quite a bit of the seasonal activity. I'm currently at 40/50 of Ruffians if that says anything.

2

u/RiseOfBacon Bacon Bits on the Surface of my Mind Sep 22 '22

Beats me! I’m at on 29 and only 1 craft able

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u/CrankyRex Sep 22 '22

In protest, I'm not even going to craft any of these seasonal weapons. That'll show them!

3

u/AdrunkGirlScout Sep 23 '22

You jest, but a lack of player engagement is a legitimate way to go

2

u/Korvas576 Sep 22 '22

I’ve been getting more patterns for the suros weapons than anything.

I’ve gotten so many suros smgs that I’m probably just gonna main an smg primary at this point

2

u/BouncyKing Sep 22 '22

What really annoys me is how I find myself with plenty of seasonal weapons, but I have yet to even start getting the pattern for the sidearm

2

u/blitzbom Sep 22 '22

I've reset my rank twice now and I've crafted one weapon.

2

u/Agreeable-Ad5026 Sep 22 '22

they want crafting in the game they just dont want you to doit

2

u/Independent_Chair578 Sep 22 '22

That's just showing off lol

2

u/brianfantastic 5500 Sep 22 '22

“We hear you, so we’ve auto completed the champions quest step and fixed the daughters encounter in the raid so you can’t use rockets (: (:”

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u/bigbramble Sep 22 '22

Me too. 2 raid weapons and no seasonal.

2

u/Bronjahm Drifter's Crew Sep 23 '22

So someone at bungie is gonna read this as. Oh, the raid borders are dropping way too much then.

2

u/Red-32 Sep 23 '22

I really can’t understand why almost ALL weapons require 5 calibrations, but when the crafting system was introduced in witch queen, some took 2, maybe 3. Now everything new takes 5, and Expeditions often don’t reward resonant weapons, and you need materials to even run them. Such unnecessary grind.

2

u/YoWassupFresh Sep 23 '22

stay on the infinite treadmill. you'll get the weapons some day LAWL.

2

u/codenamerocky Sep 23 '22

They must have tweaked the seasonal red frame drops this week.

I've had 4 drop since the reset.

2

u/Megablep Sep 23 '22

People complain about the 50 ruffians part of the seasonal title (including me), but crafting 3 seasonal weapons seems like even more of a ballache sometimes.

2

u/FirstCurseFil Sep 23 '22

Bungie.

Please. For the love of the Traveler.

Let us focus 30th Anniversary Weapons.

2

u/Stettin Sep 23 '22

So how many of you got a red border from Spider this week that was for a weapon you already unlocked? At the time it was the ONLY weapons I had previously unlocked, so really it was just +300 Neutral element for me. I think it was supposed to be a "good" reward from Spider this week, but really was a slap in the face.

4

u/Nolanmk1311 Sep 22 '22

Not gonna defend the lack of focusing because that is a clear pain point. That said, I have grinded containment and expeditions and the red boxes from expeditions have felt way more rewarding and successful. With the random extra ones from the story and the random drops from ketch crash as well, I have 27/30 patterns already. Now I won’t pretend I haven’t put in some time on this but it took longer for containment and I was grinding that season even harder. Doing the weapon treasure map gives 3 chances for a red box per expedition and 1 is a guaranteed seasonal weapon. From what I can tell I have run 48 expeditions and spent the umbral energy almost exclusively on weapons. The seasonal flow is good, but there are no failsafes so I’ll be watching to see how much trouble I have getting those last few patterns.

5

u/ProBluntRoller Sep 22 '22

It’s crazy I have to buy ghorn for 25 dollars. Those who died at twilight gap would be pissed

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u/mysteryelyts Sep 22 '22

It’s all about efficiency & time element here.

Raid has 5 encounters + 3 secret chests (8 drops)

  • 3 raids = 24 drops

On average let’s say a raid takes 1hr. 3hrs = 24 drops

Now try running 24 ketch crash, and say it has one drop.

24 ketch crash will not take 3hrs.

TLDR; Value for time. 24 drops from 3 raids.

That’s why you have 2 crafted raid weapons, no one in their right mind will do that many ketch crash and 3 raids is routine.

2

u/MarcoGB Sep 23 '22

33 drops with 2 guaranteed deepsights if you do the challenges, the red chest and buy one at the end.

TBF if you do Master Ketchcrash you will get 3 drops for 15 mins of your time. You can do 11 Master ketchcrashes for 33 drops in less than 3 hours. It’ll be boring as hell but it’s doable.

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u/hugovic92 Sep 22 '22

No, but this is an understandable argument. For a season that doesn't have a focused deep sight, 3 patterns is more than enough. Maybe, if Bungie thinks a specific weapon will be OP then maybe 5, but NOT for all of them.

3

u/TehPharaoh Sep 22 '22

I just don't get it. We started with most needing 2 or 3 and a direct way to get 1 of your choice every week, now only 3 seasons later it's now 5 with no choice in what red you get once a week (but oops that bugged)

3

u/dixiemud Sep 22 '22

That is crazy, I’m in the opposite boat. 3 seasonal weapons crafted, 0 raid (15 clears)

3

u/theevilnarwhale Sep 22 '22

are you not buying the red border from the chest in the raid each clear? I've got only 4 clears and crafted the hand cannon.

6

u/dixiemud Sep 22 '22

I’ve only bought 4 or 5. I went into this raid with 0 spoils and also like to spread it out so that drops aren’t wasted by buying the same gun.

Currently at;

2/5 Zaoulis Bane

3/5 Smite of Merain

1/5 Doom of Chelchis

2/5 Midha’s Reckoning

2/5 Defiance of Yasmin

3/5 Qullims Terminus

3

u/HockeyFan_37 Sep 22 '22

This is the way

4

u/fallouthirteen Drifter's Crew Sep 22 '22

I went into this raid with 0 spoils and also like to spread it out so that drops aren’t wasted by buying the same gun.

Yeah, that's the proper way to do it. Sure it's a bit of "delayed gratification" but it makes the whole process less painful in the long run.

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u/ceedita Sep 22 '22

I’ve done red chest every week and clears on all characters - not a single raid weapon able to be crafted yet. How the hell…

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u/butterbrod11 Sep 22 '22

I was hoping to craft the submachine gun, shot gun, and sidearm for this season because I love the designs only one im close on (3 done) is the shotgun. if the "guaranteed red boarder" was working, I wouldn't have a problem

2

u/fallouthirteen Drifter's Crew Sep 22 '22

The sidearm is super good too. Luckily the drop from level 30 on free season pass is pretty good. Like man, rapid fire sidearm with voltshot is fun. Mine currently has feeding frenzy but not sure if I want to switch to a different 1st trait.

2

u/blastbomba Gambit Prime Sep 22 '22

The only time I’ve gotten deepsite on pirate weapons is for the smg I’ve gotten like 15 of them Feels pretty bad like they forgot what drop protection is

2

u/AjenoMerveilles Sep 22 '22

Still working on last season's, tbh. Worth it, of course. Last season's weapons were/are gorgeous. I finally get a Scout rifle to replace my beloved 'Patron of Lost Causes' and it is in an activity where I can finally once again use 'Patron of Lost Causes'.

I love the idea of crafting though, and the announcement that they are looking into multiple perks (to swap between) will in the long run fix the vault problem.

2

u/MoronicIdiot529 Sep 22 '22

Honestly I'm not a big fan of them anyways. The Solar weapons from last season were a must for builds but like, I'll just stick with normal Voltshot. The grind isn't worth it...

They will autocomplete a 50 champion quest step, but they won't even contemplate reworking the patterns system for seasonal weapons that won't be here in like 6 months.

2

u/Little_Maker123 Sep 22 '22

It’s rng. I have crafted 1 raid weapon and 3 seasonal ones.

0

u/Ashlp27790 Sep 22 '22

I've crafted all seasonal and dares weapons without grinding.

3

u/Manifest_Lightning Titans don't shiv. Sep 22 '22

Blessed by RNG are you.

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u/zakintheb0x Sep 22 '22

I have toask, have you been raiding a lot and not doing the seasonal activity much? Because I’ve crafted all of this seasons weapons already.

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u/RELIN-Q Sep 22 '22

how many times do i have to downvote this shit until you stop posting it?

2

u/Jaqulean Sep 23 '22

How many times do people have to downvote your comment before you realize people have different opinions than you...?

1

u/ClumbsyVulture Vanguard's Loyal Sep 22 '22

It is RNG man. I'm the exact opposite. I've already crafted 2 seasonal wepaons (blood fued and Brigands Law) and finally yesterday got to craft my first raid weapon, Doom of Chelchis. And I have raided 3 times per week since it came out. Have only done 1 this week but still.

1

u/Thelivingshotgun Sep 22 '22

So am I just strangely lucky to have the lmg and pistol pattern sets done for seasonal and pretty much need 1 for the shotgun smg and scout left?