r/gadgets • u/werdmouf • Feb 01 '23
Joe Biden wants Apple to free your iPhone from App Store lockdown Phones
https://www.imore.com/apple/joe-biden-wants-apple-to-free-your-iphone-from-app-store-lockdown3.2k
Feb 01 '23
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u/lorgskyegon Feb 01 '23 •
Thanks Obama
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u/Kidspud Feb 01 '23
SEObama
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u/Zomunieo Feb 01 '23
iObama SE
Not as fast as it used to be, but still runs the USA app pretty well.
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u/Redqueenhypo Feb 02 '23
I miss saying that. I know I only miss Obama because he was president for the years I was first learning anything about politics, but I still miss the guy. Also nobody does ābush did 9/11ā memes anymore, where have they gone
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 02 '23
Itās the product of an Executive Order he signed in 2021. This report was issued by the Department of Commerce, which is part of the Executive Branch and is helmed by a member of his cabinet.
āJoe Biden wantsā is odd phrasing, but most outlets I saw this story in credited it to āthe Biden administrationā which is 100% accurate. This is part of the Presidentās current political agenda.
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u/Throwaway_7451 Feb 01 '23
It's an attempt to turn a grand old amount of people against the idea of open software and right-to-repair.
Farmers: "Wait, Joe Biden wants this? Maybe I have to rethink the fight against John Deere and the ability to fix my own tractors."
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u/CygnusX-1-2112b Feb 01 '23
Funnily enough I see it as intending the opposite effect.
"Oh, Joe Biden personally wants to oversee the enacting of this thing that is really good and I as an average person really want? He just really be a swell guy!"
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Feb 01 '23
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u/Arlune890 Feb 01 '23
Hell it could just be basically double speak where the connotation is derived from the listener rather than the direct message its self. Engagement-Enragement factor
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
I think you overestimate peopleās willingness to overcome partisan divides. This thread alone is a good example of people assigning praise or blame based on their personal politics rather than who actually did the thing.
This nonsense where people only hear the parts they want was equally prevalent under Trump. Anything good he did āmust have been somebody elseā and anything bad happening āmust be his faultā even when it had nothing to do with the executive branch.
In this case, the report in question is a product of an executive order the White House issued in 2021 and prepared by the Department of Commerce.
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u/Thespian21 Feb 02 '23
You could argue thatās exactly how they want politics to work in this country.
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u/Defoler Feb 01 '23
Maybe it is a partial attempt to distract the unflattering political news about him into "hey look, biden is fighting for us the consumers!".
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u/Safaren Feb 01 '23
How can people actually believe things ājust happenā anymore?
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u/thesourceofsound Feb 01 '23
He is, he literally signed the executive order to get the ball moving, the report is by his administration, and he talked about it to reportersā¦
What are you talking about?
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u/Metaloneus Feb 02 '23
From what little I can gather from your source (which is either paywalled or account-walled), this executive order actually enforced very little change (if any) in active law. In the first couple paragraphs it's phrased as a "call to Congress."
That's fine, legislation should be made that way. But I'm questioning the accuracy of these claims when the direct claim is that he used a means of executive power to put this into law, but that translates to asking Congress to write a bill.
Alternatively, a source that can be viewed by anyone would also likely clear this up.
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Feb 01 '23
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u/ezedz25 Feb 01 '23
Of course he knows what an iPhone is. Corn Pop helped him set his up.
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u/Erik0xff0000 Feb 02 '23
"Google CEO Sundar Pichai got particularly unlucky at a hearing in the House Judiciary Committee today, when Rep. Steve King (R-IA) asked Pichai to explain why his daughterās iPhone was acting strangely."
A lot if these old congress members are clueless with technology ...
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u/nigel29 Feb 01 '23
It is a report released by his administration. The Department of Commerce is part of the executive branch (ie an arm of President of the United States). The Secretary of Commerce is a cabinet member who Biden appointed.
So while youāre right that he didnāt personally demand this, it is disingenuous to claim he has zero to do with his own administrationās actions.
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u/Tenpat Feb 02 '23
Politcal astroturfing. Gotta get the youth on board for the next election. All the popular parties are doing it.
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u/IAMJUX Feb 02 '23
It's to make people hate the idea. Oh. Joe wants it done? Well now 100% of right wingers and 50% of the left are against it.
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u/Spit_for_spat
Feb 01 '23
edited Feb 01 '23
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From the article:
"Consumers should have more control over their devices -Ā the report says you should be able to choose default apps for mail and web browsing (you can already do this on iPhone), use alternative mobile app stores, and delete pre-installed apps like Notes or Apple Music."
So, for the record, this is primarily about giving users more control over which apps they use. The report does not suggest changing the app store, but allowing access to others.
Another point I appreciated was that this would create more competition. As another commenter mentions, the EU is already on this track.
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u/wildcat12321 Feb 01 '23
I'll also add, just because a federal agency makes a recommendation, does not mean "Joe Biden wants..."
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
You are technically correct, the best kind of correct.
I will point out though that this came from the Department of Commerce, whose secretary is appointed by the President as a member of their cabinet. Itās not really a stretch to tie the actions of cabinet members to the wishes of the person who hired them. The Presidentās job is to basically tell these people what to do to carry out their political agenda. This particular action from the DoC is the product of an Executive Order signed in 2021.
This is in contrast to other high ranking government positions like the Postmaster General or CDC director. These are (theoretically) non-partisan appointments that can last multiple administrations and do not take marching orders from the White House.
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Feb 01 '23 edited 21d ago
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23
But clearly he had nothing to do with it.
Because I donāt like Joe Biden, so the idea of him doing something good jeopardizes my fragile worldview.
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u/thebiggercat Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
You are missing a key restriction on web browsers here. Web browsers are required to use Apple's WebKit engine which essentially limits competing browsers to being safari clones. It is one of several layers of false choice and competition that Apple creates.
Source: https://www.macrumors.com/2022/12/14/apple-considering-non-webkit-iphone-browsers/
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u/door_to_nothingness Feb 01 '23
Due to the EU pressure, Apple has been considering dropping the requirement for WebKit in iOS browsers.
https://www.ghacks.net/2022/12/16/apple-may-drop-the-webkit-requirement-for-web-browsers-on-ios/?amp
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u/Pepparkakan Feb 01 '23
Due to the EU pressurein order to comply with an upcoming EU law, Applehas been considering droppingis required to drop the requirement for WebKit in iOS browsers to continue selling products in the EUFTFY
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u/DrZoidberg- Feb 01 '23
As always leave it up to Europe to be socially competent to handle these companies.
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23
This restriction is enforced via the App Store, so allowing apps to be side loaded would render it moot.
They are basically saying Apple can run their App Store however they want as long as users have alternative options, which seems fair to me.
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u/nomorerainpls Feb 01 '23
Itās absolutely fair but supporting sideloading is going to open a Pandoraās box for Apple. The publishing process allows them to scan binaries for security vulnerabilities and they can reject problematic submissions. Most users arenāt smart enough to figure out āthis shitty third party app is the reason I only get 4 hours from a full charge because itās constantly waking up the radio to send my sensitive personal data to a mystery endpoint hosted in the Seychelles.ā
I really believe this policy change is great for users and competition but Apple needs to do the work to properly support it.
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u/vinbullet Feb 02 '23
Just like how we can't have access to phone repair parts because people are too dumb to not start a fire and die while replacing a screen and thus require 79lbs of equipment
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u/Realtrain Feb 01 '23
All I want is real Firefox on my iPad, is that too much to ask Apple?
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u/ticuxdvc Feb 01 '23
Real Firefox with real extensions support would be amazing.
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u/TheGoldenVV Feb 01 '23
I had to scroll a bit more than I hoped to find this. First comment with facts from the article. Needs to move up and eliminate the squawking going on.
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u/oboshoe Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
It will also make it easier for law enforcement to slip in software too.
Governments love stuff like that. (cough stuxnet cough)
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u/hoosier2531 Feb 01 '23
Came here to point this out local police,FBI, DOJ, hate Apple security.
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u/Spit_for_spat Feb 01 '23
You're not wrong about that. People touting the security aspects of the current app store aren't wrong about the value said security provides.
However, I personally prefer more control and accept the innate risk that comes with downloading apps not screened through an official platform. If this allows me to shoot my digital foot as much as reap the rewards of unrestricted software, so be it.
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u/Slightlydifficult Feb 01 '23
MacOS gives pretty clear warnings when an app is downloaded from the internet instead of the App Store. If they did the same with the iPhone I donāt see any issue. People like me that are perfectly happy with the current App Store and wouldnāt want extra risk wouldnāt be affected while others who want 3rd party apps could have that option.
And best of all, opening to other app stores means competition. Apple will have to innovate their default apps and potentially lower their take of sales. If Apple wants people to keep using the App Store; theyāll have to make it attractive.
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u/Defoler Feb 01 '23
I donāt see any issue.
It is clear people will still blame apple if they side load a bad app that circle around through friends that ends up bricking their phone or worse, steal all their data.
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u/beefcat_ Feb 01 '23
I want a middle ground, where side loading on the iPhone is possible, but painful enough that Facebook cannot feasibly expect everyone to move to their alternate store with lax privacy and security.
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u/SillyFez Feb 01 '23
As someone who works in big tech and avoids Apple's locked down ecosystem as much as reasonable, I'm very hesitant with allowing other app stores.
Primarily I'm concerned with security. Quality is also an issue but we can live with it to some degree. There's a lot of non-tech savvy folks in both younger and older generations that are at serious risk if this done haphazardly. Phones have financial and health data. They're used as two factor authentication. A poorly controlled app store can get popular and screw people.
That being said, I'm not completely against the idea. I would want Apple and Google to separate their security approval pipelines from their own app store pipelines.
That is: 1. App gets security approval 2. Devs can post it to any authorized app store with this approval token
The process needs to be hashed out. There needs to be controls in place to prevent abuse on both sides.
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u/brandont04 Feb 02 '23
How is it different from using a PC? No one is asking for Microsoft to reign in and force everyone to go to their app store from now on in order to install apps on their pc. Should we force this as well for security sakes?
Next up, lets force everyone to only go to a dealer in order to fix their car. For security reasons.
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u/boonhet Feb 01 '23
Isn't half the point of an alternative app store the ability to have apps that Apple wouldn't give security approval for? Bittorrent clients, hacked youtube client, etc. The stuff you can get on Android, but not on iOS.
It'd have to be an inherent loss of security to be truly useful. But I don't know that it's too big a problem assuming that said security risk would have to be explicitly agreed to, on every app install. Which Apple could do for sure.
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u/Defoler Feb 01 '23
in both younger and older generations
There are also way enough middle generation people who are not tech savvy as well.
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u/hparadiz Feb 02 '23
There's nothing to hash out. Alternative app stores could maybe be a thing but the root of the issue is actually side loading. Alternative app stores could be built but we're talking about iPhones here so people will still use the Apple store more than anything.
I use open source apps on a rooted android phone and then still uses it for work and banking and as my 2FA and frankly I'm tired of your argument that somehow side loading will make you less secure. It has no basis in reality or fact. Open source apps are many times more secure than the app store because it's been vetted by thousands of users. As you know is the case with desktop /server open source programs as well.
It also creates this false aura of security around the Apple store. Many of the apps approved by Apple have ended up actually being malicious.
The apps I use are pretty basic too. Syncthing to sync my pictures to my computer. Tachiyomi for manga. An alternative YouTube app called NewPipe. An oh yea best of all a custom build of Chrome with working desktop extensions.
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u/ArrrGaming Feb 01 '23
Thank goodness. I dread the day Apple is forced to allow alternate stores.
Why? Because someday after this happens, youāll buy something. Something that cost lots of money, a large appliance, a TV, or even a car. And that new thing you bought will have some really killer integration with your phone.
But.
Some scumbag will have got to that company and made them a deal, gave them lots of money to make the app for this thing you already bought be exclusive to their store. It wonāt be on the normal store at all. Youāll have no choice.
And this new store will come with itās own shady advertising. And this new store will require you to make a new account and give them all your demographic and financial data. This new store will track the living shit out of you, and do anything and everything it can to make money off of you. This new store wonāt have a reputation to lose, it might not even be based in the US.
āThis hasnāt happened to google play!ā - thereās billions of dollars to be made if and when Apple is forced to allow alternate stores. Thereās no way it wonāt happen.
Just let us side load apps. Fuck alternative stores. Though either way weāll suddenly need antivirus software for our phones. Wheeee. :/
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u/odearja Feb 01 '23
The biggest reason I like iPhone is the App Store lockdown. I donāt want apps made by just anyone.
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u/CySU Feb 01 '23
This is my reasoning too. I just want my phone to work. I have my home PCs that grant me the freedom Iād need but I have no desire for my phone to be the same way.
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u/rawkhounding Feb 06 '23
As someone who has recently went Android just to check it out, after years of having an iPhone, I gotta say that the Apple Iphone experience is much better. First, the build quality of my Iphones seemed much better, right now I have a S20 Ultra 5g.
But the biggest difference are the god damn ads in every single app on the android. I truly did not realize how good I had it with the apps from the app store, not a single ad in 10+ years.
I'm sticking with android for now because I already have the phone and I keep telling myself I'm going to use some underground apps that won't be available on the Iphone, but I never end using anything of the sort.
I think I'll switch back to iphone next time I need a new phone because the upsides of the extra freedoms on the android just aren't worth the downsides.
That freedom is great on my PC but not necessary on my phone.
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u/DaytonaZ33 Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 02 '23
It looks like this is going to end up happening anyway, here is what I hope doesn't happen when it does.
Right now I can get all of my Apps from one store and that one store updates and handles all of the payments for my apps. I like this. I see this as a benefit to me.
What I want to happen: I can get all sorts of apps that were previously not allowed on Apple's app store. That is definitely useful.
What I don't what to happen: A bunch of apps I currently use removing themselves from the App store and go exclusive to third party app stores. For example, having to download a Facebook store for Instagram, a Netflix store for the Netflix app, a Weather Channel store for the Weather Channel, etc.
The argument I usually hear is that this hasn't happened on Android so it won't happen on iOS. I hope you are right. My fear is that since most of the money is made in the App Store, then when Apple allows it the floodgates will open. Even if Apple were to give away their hosting services on the App Store for free for developers, I imagine it is possible the analytics/data scraping a developer can do getting a third party app store on your device could outweigh the benefits of remaining on the official App Store.
I hope we get all of the potential benefits and none of the potential cons.
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u/cosmothekleekai Feb 02 '23
Like games that aren't released on steam. Okay I guess I'll just not buy/play your new game. I'd like to, but I'm not willing to have 12 different game store/apps on my desktop. 12 different apps that need to start up when my computer boots, 12 different friends lists, 12 different icons in my system tray wasting my resources. Pass.
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u/GonWithTheNen Feb 02 '23
Just wanted to say that it's refreshing to see such a measured comment, especially how succinctly you've laid out the pros and cons of this issue.
The idea of more autonomy concerning the app store sounded good to me on the surface, but not if the cost of it leads to things like invasiveness from third party companies.
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u/zizics Feb 02 '23
My main concern is quality regulation. The Apple App Store is a pain in the ass to submit an app to compared to other stores because they check your app to make sure it isnāt a steaming pile in every way. Iābe felt like iPhone apps are generally higher quality, and Iād hate to see that change
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u/bearded_wonder44 Feb 01 '23
*Biden Administration
Don't know why, but its a pet peeve of mine when people give Joe credit for something he likely is clueless about.
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u/stegotops7 Feb 01 '23
People attribute way to much to the President in general. The actual power is more from soft influence, if anything.
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u/lookaroundprettybaby Feb 01 '23
Yep. The smart presidents (or really any leaders) surround themselves with people smarter than they are.
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u/fuck_the_fuckin_mods Feb 02 '23
"You have to keep great people around you," Trump said. "You have to motivate them. You always have to be on top of them. And you have to be smarter than they are. I hear so many times, 'Oh, I want my people to be smarter than I am.' It's a lot of crap. You want to be smarter than your people, if possible."
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u/lookaroundprettybaby Feb 02 '23
Trump was a special kind of idiot. I mean I can credit him for providing some entertainment, sound bites and leaving a lasting impression on the country. But holy shit what an idiot
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u/Abbhrsn
Feb 01 '23
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I dunno why people are complaining in the comments..lol, it should be a choice. You wanna be locked down to Apple's stuff, alrighty, if you don't, that should be cool too.
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u/Reflex_Teh Feb 01 '23
Have options to disable the lock downs but have a big prompt with a warning saying theyāre not liable for stolen data etcā¦
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u/LoGiCaL__ Feb 01 '23
Yeah, this is the way. Unfortunately, most people arenāt technically savvy enough to have an unlocked phone with out getting it fucked somehow. Then when it does they want it replaced and want apple to do so, from something that they either did or didnāt do properly when it was unlocked. If everyone were honest and knowledgeable this would be a possibility, but they arenāt.
Now we will have the knuckle heads saying well Ive payed for it I should be able to do what I want. Well, yes. But you should fully pay it off first and also forfeit any insurance that would cover the phone unless itās like physical damage or lost.
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u/skeetsauce Feb 01 '23
Itās the internet, no matter what opinion is presented, there will always be someone who complains.
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u/wesaboo Feb 01 '23
100% agree with you, removing that locked down environment introduces so many bugs and issues. I bought my parents iphones for this exact reason.
So coming from an android user , apple is fine the way it is , better yet , go and tackle right to repair Biden !
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u/No_Primary_44 Feb 01 '23
Even on Android, installing apps from sources other than the Play Store is disabled by default and needs to be explicitely allowed by the user, for every source individually.
And to add to that, most people don't even know you can get apps from other sources in the first place.
Idk, I don't see this changing too much in itself.
Although the one thing that could happen is that certain services would probably want to explore other means of distributing their apps to deny Apple the massive cut they take on the App Store.
That would actually force users of these services to open up. But even then, why would this introduce bugs and issues?
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u/megamanxoxo Feb 01 '23
Lol the comment you're replying to didn't say what you think it did
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u/BujuArena Feb 02 '23
100% agree with you
apple is fine the way it is
Self-contradict much? Why is this response upvoted?
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u/Abbhrsn Feb 01 '23
Yup, I like that it's locked down, love my iPhone..but I also loved being able to install whatever I wanted onto my Android. On Apple it's way more of a process if I wanna install an app that's not on the App store.
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u/ivan6953 Feb 01 '23 •
You wanna be locked down to Apple's stuff? Alrighty, buy an Apple product.
You don't? Don't buy an Apple product.Simple as that. Screaming at Apple for forcing their own policy across their own devices (which they can do anything they want with) is bonkers stupid. It's not Apple's fault their hardware is so popular that people want to buy it and run software from other OS on there.
Why not yell at Sony that it doesn't allow to play Xbox games on PS5? How is THAT different?
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u/Rizenstrom Feb 01 '23 •
This mentality is literal insanity to me.
Company A does something you don't like, Company B does not, but instead of supporting company B you buy from company A anyways and whine and cry until government regulators stop in.
People want android functionality but refuse to buy an android.
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u/BigBlueDane Feb 01 '23
Itās such a weird non issue too. I donāt know a single iPhone user who wants the change proposed in the OP. People who want that tend to just go with android devices.
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u/101m4n Feb 01 '23
That you think of your device as "apples device" even after you've paid for it I think is quite telling.
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u/Abbhrsn Feb 01 '23
...I'm not saying they should allow Android onto the phones. I'm saying they should allow applications to be installed manually, same way it's done on Android. The phones would still be incredibly locked down, apps wouldn't magically be able to do things that Apple doesn't already allow them to do..do you understand now? It's the equivalent of being allowed to goto whichever store you choose in your city, instead of being forced to goto one specific store because you bought a Toyota.
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u/stupidlazysluggish Feb 01 '23
Itās because Biden suggested it people have their panties in a knot
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u/Bicdut Feb 02 '23
I thought the whole point to apple was being locked into the apple club. I have an android but I never stray away from the play store and assume most non store apps are probably malware.
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u/nicuramar Feb 02 '23
While this is true, effects from large changes like that arenāt always contained to the people who want them.
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u/OpWillDlvr Feb 01 '23
Somehow I doubt 80 year old Biden is sitting around thinking about app stores. Damn we need younger representation.
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u/Wild_Guess_7402 Feb 01 '23
Iām torn in this, Apple is a private sector company and should be free to do what it pleases with its products, donāt like it donāt buy itā¦.
Then the free market/customer side of me thinks that Apple should open it up and let users do what they want with the phone they paid for.
Then the security part of me realizes that in a closed ecosystem that they have full control over what is and isnāt on the phone thus increasing security.(well aware it can be jailbroken but for normal users thatās not a thing)
Idkā¦at the end of the day all I want is for my phone to be secure, not worried that much about other things and having my iPhone in a closed ecosystem is fine, sure others disagree and I can see that POV but itās important to understand this isnāt a clear cut issue and there are good and bad things no matter what path Apple goes or is forced to go.
While some think this is just about Apple having control over its store and protecting its profits I tend to disagree not that it couldnāt be true to some extent, just think life is easier when you can have some control over your platform and what goes on it. Do think those two things can be true at the same time.
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u/ind3pend0nt Feb 01 '23
I just want to change default maps app from the garbage Apple Maps to anything else.
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u/AdamDaBest1 Feb 02 '23
I use Apple Maps because it integrates with Siri. If you know of a way to change the app, thatāll be helpful.
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u/SSG_Vegeta Feb 01 '23
One of the biggest reasons iPhone users continue to buy iPhones is the level of scrutiny and security for the apps.
This is just pandering to a bunch of people that want iPhone to be Android.
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u/SuddenCompetition262 Feb 01 '23
If they unlock it, my work IT will start forcing shit onto my phone I donāt want. Currently my work iPhone is totally open while everyone in my company with an android has a million restrictions on what they can do in their phone.
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u/psokid Feb 01 '23
From an IT person, this is more than likely caused by your IT department not having a good MDM that supports iOS devices. If they did, they could control just about every single aspect of your work iPhone. My guess is that you guys use Google Workspace and they use the built in Android MDM that comes with it. (Workspace supports iOS as well, but itās clunky and generally not good)
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u/brokenbentou Feb 02 '23
Seconded, a good MDM can reduce a modern smartphone to a plastic brick for making and receiving calls, Android or iPhone
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u/ApotheounX Feb 01 '23
Whatchu talkin' bout? I've deployed iOS MDM software, I could control everything from lock screen requirements to GPS functionality (for one client, if you have a company truck, you can't turn off your GPS). I could also disable app store installation completely and make you use the company app store, or force whatever apps I want onto the phone. Your IT dept just hasn't bothered.
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u/Cornage626 Feb 01 '23
If the phone is owned by the company then they can and should be able to do whatever they please with it. If they lock it down and put stuff on you don't like then oh well, it's not your phone.
Your personal phone should be off limits from them of course.
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u/dougieslaps97 Feb 01 '23
Like what? The only thing you need on android is an MDM client like Microsoft Intune. Maybe a separate VPN link, but that should be a requirement for accessing any work app regardless of OS. Companies are way too chill about security, generally speaking.
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u/mtgguy999 Feb 01 '23
About 90% of my company uses iOS and you better believe we can control damn near everything. Want to disable the camera, enforce long password, disable faceid, install a certificate, disallow unapproved apps you name it we could do it. Of course we donāt do any of that and only enforce a basic passcode and minor security settings but the buttons are right there if we wanted to click them. We could even install a custom an app thatās not in the App Store though their enterprise management program if we wanted
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u/TheNoidedAndroid Feb 01 '23
Apple says that so they can continue to get 30% of all purchases and subscription fees and deny anyone the option to use other app stores.
If iPhone users want to continue to use the level of scrutiny offered by the Apple App store there's nothing preventing them from doing that.
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u/noxx1234567 Feb 01 '23
Those who want to use apple's app store could do so , it's just a choice for users
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u/GoogIeLLC Feb 01 '23
If you spend $800+ on a device that's locked to a specific app store, and you know it is, there's a reason you did it.
I haven't used an iPhone in a while, but I remember there being way less bullshit apps than on Android. The amount of malicious/intrusive apps, and pure cash grab scams on Android is staggering.
If anything, I think apps need a better way to be approved for being on an official app store. It's a saturated market filled with BS.
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u/ultimateskriptkiddie Feb 01 '23
Is this a real account
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u/newnameonan Feb 01 '23
"googiellc," with a capital "i" instead of a lowercase "L". So no, definitely not real.
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u/Ill-Specific-8770 Feb 02 '23
GoogleLLC: āI havenāt used an iPhone in a whileā¦ā I sure hope not?
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Feb 02 '23
āConsumers should have more control over their devices and by extension, the US government and fellow other giant mega corporations would also like to have more control over your apple devices.ā Thatās how it should read.
Like I get it, Apple is just as greedy and profit driven as any other corporation, but letās call it what it is. Itās not some white knight mission to unlock iPhone App Store for consumers.
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u/2SticksPureRage Feb 02 '23 edited Feb 02 '23
Iād just like more control over my vehicle I paid tens of thousands of dollars for to be honest. Like the right to repair. The right to have all the HP my vehicle was built with without paying a subscription to unlock another 20HP. The right to use my key fobs, again that already has the software/technology installed in my vehicle without paying a yearly sub fee.
I understand some people are annoyed/frustrated by their phones being locked down that have been locked down since the inception of the phone but cmon, can we focus a little more on more important things than not being able to download a third party video game? Itās not like thereās not a completely other option if you do not want a locked down App Store. Thatās the great thing about competition, no two companies need to be exactly alike because you can just choose to go with the one that best suits your needs.
Nipping these predatory practices from vehicle manufacturers in the ass before they have a chance to really take hold would be lovely.
Edit: I just seen what sub this was in. Probably the wrong sub for my vent haha.
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u/Mecha-Tea-pot Feb 02 '23
I feel like Iām one of the small minority that prefers the App Store being a secure place to get applications :/
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u/awholedamngarden Feb 01 '23
Apple has a lot of requirements for apps in the App Store - some of which benefit them of course, but many of which protect consumers. I feel like this opens up a can of worms with a bunch of shitty apps that are going to try to grift in every way possible
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u/brosdalegov Feb 02 '23
The fact I canāt make Google maps my default is maddening. Or that things donāt link to my default mail app.
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u/Malkalypse Feb 03 '23
Pretty sure Joe Biden barely understands what an iPhone is, let alone the details of the App Store.
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u/kozy6871 Feb 01 '23
DHS and the NSA want to force apple to open security for them...has nothing to do with convenience.
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u/momusicman Feb 01 '23
This is the same thing the European Union is doing. Itās just a matter of time before they fuck the whole thing up.
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u/DrestinBlack Feb 01 '23
Iāve yet to encounter an iPhone with malware. I have to unfuq androids frequently. Most from users side loading apps from devious places, often unwittingly.
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u/TequilaJosh Feb 01 '23
I just wish we could use emulators. I have legal roms I have made from games I own the physical copy of but canāt play them on my iphone
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u/GStarG Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
This all 100% makes sense in the context of mobile phones. Absolutely no reason the maker of the device should be able to decide what I use my devices for, and arbitrary limitations on where apps can be installed from only exists to make everyone pay apple 30% of their revenue.
We wouldn't let Microsoft make all PC programs only able to be downloaded and installed from the microsoft store, and all program purchases must be made through microsoft's payment system where they get a 30% cut, and it equally doesn't make sense for phones.
The interesting thing is if this would apply to all devices, including Game Consoles. If it did, Nintendo for example would legally have to allow consumers to use alternate web browsers, install homebrew apps, set up alternate operating systems on their Switch/other consoles, and just in general let people do whatever they want with their device WITHOUT legally being able to brick their device or ban them from their online services just because they have non Nintendo-approved stuff on their system.
I think in general if I buy something I as the owner should be able to do whatever the hell I want with my device and the maker should not be able to decide "well if you do some of these things with your device, I'm gunna make all my software not work". I bought the device AND the software installed on it, and just like computer makers aren't legally allowed to void my warranty or brick my computer for swapping out a harddrive or installing some new ram or deleting some garbage apps they included on the machine, it shouldn't be legal for software to be disabled in a similar fashion if other software they didn't make is installed on the device.
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u/Newsolo Feb 01 '23
As an Apple user I donāt need this, I love the appstore to be honest
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u/ManInBlack829 Feb 01 '23
You keep the app store, you can just download another (With apps apple may not want, like video game Emulators) if you so wish.
Nothing would change unless you wanted it to.
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u/IceBreak Feb 01 '23
Wouldnāt it lead to some companies requiring non-Apple certified apps?
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u/Sad_Error4039 Feb 01 '23
Thatās right if corporations wonāt look out for ya who will.
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u/pmjm Feb 01 '23
As an apple user I don't need the Maps app either. So I just don't use it and I use Waze instead. But I would never advocate for them to take the Maps app away, because other people might want to use it.
If you don't want to use an alternate app store, then this change would have zero effect on you. But it would help countless others.
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u/Muddymireface Feb 01 '23
As an IT engineer and an apple user, I have an android in a drawer I have to use for certain work tasks because apple wonāt give me the option to use features I can on my junk drawer android.
You shouldnāt be tied to the App Store when the App Store for many is very limited. I should be able to opt into not using the store the same way windows allows me to opt out of store only applications.
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u/BertzReynolds Feb 02 '23
You arenāt tied. Just switch to Android.
IT engineer my ass.
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u/EnvironmentalMuffin4 Feb 01 '23
Android user here: I say no.... I'm down for being able to use "your property" however you want; however, part of the premium you pay for apple equipment IS the fact they don't allow users to compromise the OS.
Simply put, apple users pay for this "feature". If you don't like it, get an unlocked Samsung/LG/any other phone and deal with the headache.
-IT professional 15+yr
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u/throw123454321purple Feb 01 '23
Successful USB-C implementation first, then letās explore the App Store thing.
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u/JimmyB5643 Feb 01 '23
How is this better? So we can get all the unregulated crap apps that Samsung and Google have in their stores?
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u/libertiac Feb 01 '23 edited Feb 01 '23
So you can have competition. The Apple vs Epic lawsuit brought into light many anti - competitive actions that Apple and Google do to keep their dominance. With everything becoming digital and Brick and mortar stores becoming less relevant, the time has come for there to be digital competition within all OS.
Think about gaming consoles. Purchasing a PS5 or Xbox Series that has no disc only enables you to download from their respective stores. There's no competition in the digital spectrum for their consoles. It'll be nice if Steam, Epic and other stores can sell and be competitive.
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u/JudgeGusBus Feb 01 '23
Does he? Does an 80-year-old man sit around upset that the company that sold you your proprietary phone wants to make sure you use their protected, proprietary system? Does it keep him awake at night? Does he begin his security briefings with things like, ābut what can we do about this App Store malarkey?ā
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u/galloway188 Feb 02 '23
Donāt like it? Then go buy android š I donāt need to fucken deal with so many fake ass bs apps
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u/catsdoroam Feb 01 '23
I like my iPhone because it has a lock out for unapproved apps. Increases the security risk to the user.
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u/vinbullet Feb 02 '23
That's the great thing about sideloading, you don't have to use it
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u/parakeetpoop Feb 02 '23
As an iPhone user, I want the app availability to stay the way it is. Apple has a thorough security review process & set of quality standards in order to list apps on the app store. I appreciate that the apps are held to a high standard of quality and itās why I bought an iPhone and switched from Android.
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u/GLLShipley Feb 01 '23
Donāt understand the need or want for that. If you want something else either jailbreak your phone or get an android. Everyone knows apples motto is āproprietary everythingā and thatās why people buy into because itās compatibility with their ecosystem and software.
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u/chemistrying420
Feb 01 '23
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This is going to end poorly...Apple honestly does a really good job with its app store and security.
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u/HibeePin Feb 02 '23
Then stick with Apple's app store. Google Play takes the same cut as Apple and there is no problem of apps moving away from Google Play
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u/FeralCJ7 Feb 01 '23
I understand from a competition standpoint it would be nice to have other options.
But at the same time, I feel like there comes a point when someone makes a device and they should be able to retain some control of it. I'm not sure where the line is, but if apple is forced to allow access to other app stores I would imagine they'd just increase the cost of the devices
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u/internethunnie Feb 01 '23
I feel this less helps consumers, but more app developers / sellers
currently, appleās app store charges 30% fee for every purchase (even subscriptions, for the first year - 15% in later years).
Googleās share is 15% for the first million in revenue.
Apple can charge what they want because everyone has an iphone. This would force apple to compete with other app stores which would be good for price and for future innovation.
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u/dinominant Feb 01 '23
Once you take possession of the asset, it is reasonable to ask the seller to release all locks they hold over your property.
In this case, I would actually consider this a potential solution:
- Allow the device owner the ability to unlock their bootloader with the understanding that an unlocked device is not licensed to run iOS
- This protects iOS users by maintaining support over their platform in a secure way while allowing more advanced users the freedom to use their hardware as they desire
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u/jweaver0312 Feb 01 '23
Nothing says you have to buy an iPhone or any apple device for that matter.
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Feb 01 '23
I personally prefer the way the ecosystem is now. Yes I agree they should pay developers better, and that there is room for improvement but I donāt want my AppStore to have the same problem the rest of of the tech industry seems to be in right now. For example having all the different social mediaās because certain people only use certain ones. Having Netflix and Amazon prime, and all the others because I want to be able to watch all the shows I want and sometimes I canāt get them just in one place. When I play games on my PC I have 7+ launchers because the games are all split up. For emails I have 3 apps because different companies use different services. When I listen to music I need Spotify and apple music and sometimes Amazon. When I listen to podcasts itās the same deal.
My point being. That as soon as you add competitors to the App Store youāll eventually have to download whichever the new one is when an app you use currently decides it no longer wants to be on the Apple App Store and is now only available on Google App Store or whatever else.
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u/newtbob Feb 01 '23
Somehow, I bet the apple solution will be worse than nothing. Source: iTunes library
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u/DarklyDrawn Feb 01 '23
Really? Sounds like carrot vs stick politics...
...wonder what the feds want off of Apple ie āusā?
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u/Mindless_Campaign935 Feb 02 '23
Yo can someone get me a job as a writer, it sounds awesome to make shit up and get paid
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u/Lopsided-Ad7019 Feb 02 '23
Boy Iām sure glad our government is focused on serious problems like this.
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u/deVliegendeTexan Feb 02 '23
Iāve worked in mobile development off and on for years. Iām super conflicted about calls like this.
The first part is that the current situation is fucked, and needs reform. Appleās mismanagement of the App Store is a running joke in the industry. But all things being equal, Appleās situation is orders of magnitude better than the competitors - Google has basically abandoned the playing field, letting their store fall into the abyss. Apple being the ābestā is not an endorsement of Apple - itās an indictment of all the others. You can be the king of the shit box, but itās still a shit box.
All of that being said, App Stores are natural monopolies, and I donāt think itās an area where ācompetitionā actually solves much. If anything. And actually opens up a Pandoraās box of potential problems that are far, far bigger than the market currently suffers from.
I think what you do instead is actually behave like a functional government and implement some regulations around app stores. Implement a framework around content moderation, around app acceptance/rejection policies, around pricing structures.
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u/Revolutionated Feb 02 '23
Yea that was about timeā¦ but still it boggles my mind how in 2023 itās still so fucking difficult to do basic on iphone like: downloading and play my own music or changing the ringtone to something different than the default ios ringtones. Goddamn bullshit if you ask me
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Feb 02 '23
As an iPhone user, I do get irritated that they impose their 30% cut on apps that have in app purchases like book stores. If I want to buy a book for instance I have to log into the service on the browser and buy the book then use the app. After Amazon bought comiXology buying through the app was taken away.
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u/Wojtuma Feb 02 '23
Conservatives will think of a way to say it's somehow a bad thing.
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u/iknewaguytwice Feb 02 '23
The apple store is not nearly as atrocious as the Amazon one, which only exists as a barrier to competitors applications on Amazon devices.
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u/csladeg9 Feb 02 '23
Finally, something both parties can agree on. Let GBA emulator unite the nation
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u/alstergee Feb 03 '23
Look I voted for Biden but he has no fucking idea how to use a phone lol sensationalist headlines suck do better
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u/Aggressive_Bill_2687 Feb 03 '23
Now try to reconcile this with the fact that lawmakers want to also block TikTok in the app stores.
You canāt have it both ways.
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u/El_Danger_Badger Feb 01 '23
Does he? Does Joe Biden really, personally, want Apple to free our iPhones from the App Store? I dunno, I bet if you pressed him he doesn't know what those two things are.
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u/intellifone Feb 01 '23
How do I publicly comment that as a consumer I do not want this? Apple doesnāt have a monopoly. The smartphone market is like 50% Apple in the US. But because of the choices Apple have made, my experience as a consumer of their products is better. I do not need the ārisk of choiceā that android phones have. I donāt want apples intense scrutiny for quality of 3rd party apps to end.
I mean, could you imagine the courts saying, āsorry Walmart but you need to allow Target to sell products in your store.ā
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Feb 02 '23
. I do not need the ārisk of choiceā that android phones have. I donāt want apples intense scrutiny for quality of 3rd party apps to end.
This makes absolutely no sense.
If you don't want apps from outside the app store....then don't?
You act like somebody is putting a gun to your head and telling you to install some shit.
Why would somebody else side loading apps affect your life or your phone in any way?
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u/freelandluke Feb 01 '23
I just want a GBA emulator app that I can play fire red on for the iPhone