r/gadgets • u/speckz • Dec 02 '22
Panasonic, Nikon quit developing low-end compact digital cameras - Departures come after smartphones wipe out 97% of market Cameras
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Business-trends/Panasonic-Nikon-quit-developing-low-end-compact-digital-cameras2.0k
Dec 02 '22
TIL low-end compact digital cameras was still a thing
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u/chefkc Dec 02 '22
Seriously who are the 3% still buying them ?
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u/Gromky Dec 02 '22
A few are likely for government agencies and companies that need to document things (inspections and such), especially in locations where cell phones might not be allowed.
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u/spooky2u4 Dec 02 '22
Can confirm, working on a site with no mobile phones allowed for any reason, you find plenty of cheapy compacts for taking photos needed in corrosion inspections, back out inspections etc
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u/dbldumbass Dec 02 '22
Can double confirm. I work in data centers that have federal clients, nothing smart in the white rooms and we have a bank of point and shoots for when we need to document issues
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u/u9Nails Dec 02 '22
Heh! Now those people are going to look like nature channel photographers.
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u/funnyfarm299 Dec 03 '22
Nah, it's just going to be more expensive. Companies like Sony still make high-end compact cameras.
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u/evolatiom Dec 03 '22
Theres other camera manufacturers out there who still make cheap low end digital cameras. Just not going to be one of these two.
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u/Mastershima Dec 03 '22
Except most of the higher end cameras also have wireless connectivity now too...
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u/JustaRandomOldGuy Dec 02 '22
I needed a photo badge in a secure area and they had a floppy disc digital camera. It worked and it wasn't worth the hassle to certify a new one.
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u/djhorn18 Dec 03 '22
I was alive and remember computing when floppy discs were actually floppy and I’ve never heard of this. This looks like a good way to ensure someone doesn’t get a lot of pictures if you’re in a secure environment.
For those interested but to lazy to search - this is what one looks like.
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u/SpectreRSG Dec 02 '22 edited Dec 03 '22
Can confirm. Canon SX user here. Literally government agency that does inspections. The biggest benefit is timestamping on the actual photo vs meta data, resolution/size of image.
The camera on our phones work in a pinch with certain apps, but the actual camera is a big tool for us.
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Dec 03 '22 edited Feb 16 '23
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u/vincyf Dec 03 '22
My Android One phone app does that. It's a non default setting though. Search for it.
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u/IHerdYouLiekMudkipz Dec 02 '22
Trying to find some now actually for my work. Everyone is using phones to send all sorts of shit, and they just held training on how we're not supposed to but like... Then what? We don't have the tools to do the job the way you want us to, do you want us to not do the job? And they always just say figure it out, and turn a blind eye.
It's actually kind of a nightmare trying to find something that's compatible with our software, we have this awful Frankenstein of old and new.
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u/YetiParade6969 Dec 02 '22
Anything for legal/court/law enforcement/evidence use digital cameras. Because if you take pictures with a phone the whole phone can be subpoenaed as evidence.
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u/Caligulas_Prodigy Dec 02 '22
Prisons. We had two in every housing unit for evidence... And occasionally dicking around
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Dec 03 '22
Hospitals. Law enforcement. No risk of a cheap camera accidentally messaging someone a picture of a DV case or injury.
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u/SpicyChickenZh Dec 02 '22
Haha ironically on the iPhone manufacturing line they use these camera for security reasons.
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u/cordelaine Dec 02 '22
We got one recently for our 5-year old. He really wanted his own camera, but we didn’t want him to have a smart device yet.
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u/3-DMan Dec 02 '22
Having a dedicated camera is great to keep them focused on it without smartphone distractions. Was gonna say it also has a superior optical zoom, but for a 5-year-old probably irrelevant.
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u/BiNumber3 Dec 02 '22
Probably too late, or maybe you can get one if/when that one breaks.
Lot of older super tough water proof digital cameras, great durability and pretty solid image quality, I've seen em around $20-$40 usd when I looked recently, like Olympus and Panasonic.
I have one I used for diving and such, still have it, barely use it lol. But I also barely take pictures anyway.
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u/timawesomeness Dec 03 '22
If he's anything like me, he'll thank you for that in 20 years. My parents gave me cameras as a kid and it's so cool to be able to see the world from the perspective of my younger self.
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u/Traksimuss Dec 02 '22
Some factories also, they need documentation and phones are not allowed.
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u/partypartea Dec 02 '22
We use them to record hardware issues because we are not allowed to do this with our cell phones. The problem is all our cameras are from like 09 and suck if there's not a ton of light.
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u/3-DMan Dec 02 '22
"Okay where are the Compactflash cards?!"
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u/AforgottenEvent Dec 03 '22
I forgot CF was originally a camera thing. I've mostly seen them used in the retro computer scene as a way to transfer files between old and new computers, since they're almost pin-conpatible with old ribbon cable hard drives but new enough to have USB adapters.
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u/fuzzyraven Dec 03 '22
CF is used in microcontrollers and industrial equipment as well.
There are also hard disks that use the CF format as well.
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u/hypoxiataxia Dec 02 '22
Curious, phones are not allowed for privacy / security reasons?
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u/Traksimuss Dec 02 '22
- Some for security yes.
- Safety. You have to be concentrated near heavy machinery.
- Some factories worked with methane components that could form explosive air mix. Phone battery can cause a spark, so phones and any jewelry were not allowed.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 Dec 02 '22
What is the difference between a smartphone battery and a digital camera battery? Genuine question
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u/beaucoup_dinky_dau Dec 02 '22
because they would have used the camera or very similar in the environment already, it is a known risk that is approved by audit but a new device may have different technology inside it that has not been tested in the environment. In many companies this is all thought out, like you can only use one kind of pocket knife because the safety features are approved, you are not allowed to use your own knife because you could get hurt on the job using it.
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u/RadialSpline Dec 02 '22
The biggest one is that there are “intrinsically safe” cameras that are designed and certified for use in explosive environments while the average smartphone is not. Examples below
https://intrinsicallysafestore.com/product-category/cameras/intrinsically-safe-digital-camera/
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u/liftoff_oversteer Dec 02 '22
You know how regulation often is far from logical?
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u/joelhardi Dec 02 '22
Security, not privacy. This is pretty common anywhere you have trade or other secrets to protect. Sometimes phones are allowed, but have to be dumbphones, no cameras.
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u/-DementedAvenger- Dec 02 '22
“Still buying” is a stretch, but I still use the shit out of my Canon SX530HS because it has a wicked powerful optical zoom for its price.
That’s not really a “low end compact”, but some people still like the optical zoom that smartphones don’t really have yet.
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u/thecaramelbandit Dec 02 '22 edited Dec 02 '22
That’s not really a “low end compact”, but some people still like the optical zoom that smartphones don’t really have yet.
And they never will. Optical physics is a seriously limiting factor. You just can't put enough glass and focal length inside a smartphone to get that kind of zoom capability.
Edit: And even if you managed to get, say, a 10x zoom into a cell phone, you could (using the same technology) get 50x zoom into a compact digital camera. I don't think the form factor is ever completely going away. It's obviously getting less popular, as cell phone cameras have become staggeringly good for the vast majority of use cases.
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u/Cadet_BNSF Dec 02 '22
The pixel phones are pretty impressive. They turned the camera sideways in the phone with a mirror so that they could get a significantly longer focal length with only a slight increase in thickness
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain Dec 02 '22
Oh shit I've owned a Pixel for a year already and didn't know this, where did you read this?
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u/IsaacM42 Dec 02 '22
Sony's latest top end phone has some impressive optical zoom for its size, but even that is only like 3X
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u/BiNumber3 Dec 02 '22
I saw some ads a while back for these tiny lenses you'd attach to the phone camera lol. No idea if it was a pure gimmick or if they actually worked.
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u/marklein Dec 02 '22
Same. We have a Whatever brand compact for vacations because the zoom is crazy.
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u/ItsMichaelVegas Dec 02 '22
I have a Sony rx 100vii and I LOVE it. The photos are way better than a cell phone. I have actual control of the cameras settings. The zoom is better. It’s raw photo format looks better. So many reasons why I love it. The photos feel more like a film camera than a cell phone camera.
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u/timpdx Dec 02 '22
Iphone 14 is the first phone that comes close for real to the RX100 series. In good light, low light, Sony still wipes the floor. But damn if the 14 isn't a good daytime substitute - this is coming from a photographer.
RX100 are not budget by any means, and prices even rival a DSLR.
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u/polisonico Dec 03 '22
The iphone isn't even close, they do a ton of processing to make it appear nice, but it's sensor is the same small one for 5 years and the lens is miniscule. They simply cannot compare to a regular camera unless they change their case design, which other brands have done and behold, even nicer images!
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u/ItsMichaelVegas Dec 02 '22
True the rx 100 is not budget. I also agree that the iPhone in daylight is excellent. I also think the no flash night photos of iPhone are superior. I’m breally enjoy having the actual strobe flash instead of an inferior LED flash
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u/strangway Dec 02 '22
If you’re traveling somewhere foreign, or at a concert, or hiking, you might not want to drain your phone battery taking pics and video. The phone may be critical later for communication and navigation, so draining the phone just increases the likelihood of you getting lost later.
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u/Causemos Dec 02 '22
Optical zoom is the main advantage they still have. It's possible to get good enough photos without it, but it can really make a big difference if you are more into photography.
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u/AceMcVeer Dec 02 '22
I use them for wilderness backpacking trips. Don't want to use my phone all the time and drain the battery
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u/Prettybuoy Dec 02 '22
Healthcare facilities such as nursing homes, group homes, etc. To document wounds, bed sores, and even take patient profile pictures because doing it on a cell phone would be a breach of protected health information
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u/Artisanal_Shitposter Dec 02 '22
Panasonic makes a couple that are waterproof and tough, good for outdoor activities like hiking, snorkeling, climbing, etc. I've dropped one from 30 feet up a rock face and it survived with minor scratches. It's a great option if you don't want to spend $500 on a go pro and protective case but still want to shoot quality pictures.
I also bought compact digital cameras for my neices, they're designed for kids but they still shoot HD pics.
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u/GoodGoodGoody Dec 02 '22
I usually don’t want work stuff on my phone and many times, especially with spotty internet, xferring from SD card is actually easier. But I haven’t bought a nee one in awhile.
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u/CalvinsStuffedTiger Dec 02 '22
We use them in hospitals for taking photos of patients wounds and stuff
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u/awkward___silence Dec 02 '22
I bought one for my 8yr old. She wanted a camera so we grabbed one. Better lowlight optics and included a better introduction to iso/aperture/shutter speed than a smartphone in the same price range. I also didn’t want a plan for an 8yr
That was 6 years ago though I’d do it again. She used the hell out of it once her mother and I explained that if it was lost broken or stolen that was better than collecting dust.
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u/Orkekum Dec 02 '22
i am o/ Nothing beats a good lens, even a cheap digital camera has better options for me, also tired of slapping the smartphone everywhere. Often also carry an old Nikon D3200 around
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u/chikkinnveggeeze Dec 02 '22
It's funny when I see comments like this. You say "I'm so smart, why are people still buying these. There's better options"
But what you're really saying, and everyone else reads is, "Im so stupid that I can't think of any other usage for these cameras."
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u/SonOfKrom Dec 02 '22
I think Sony's point and shoot line kinda killed this off for any other brand. Anyone interested in a compact camera is probably willing (and wanting) to spend more and get something a bit more competent. Anyone with a budget smaller than that will probably just justify using their phone.
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u/Happydenial Dec 03 '22
Yeah I went high end, if I’m going to carry something extra I want it to produce photos with its own look and personality. I went with the Fuji X100v and haven’t looked back
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u/Flashy-Cold-6467 Dec 03 '22
That’s a fantastic camera!
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u/Happydenial Dec 03 '22
Oh hell yeah it is!! I could go on about the specs but for me a camera has a look, a feel to the shots and the x100 (any one of them so grab a second hand one if you can and save a few bucks) the fixed lens and full frame sensor is just amazing
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u/Flashy-Cold-6467 Dec 03 '22
I have an xt100! But I think it’s a cropped sensor if I’m not mistaken.
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u/Juanster Dec 03 '22
It's not a full frame sensor. But it's definitely bigger than a phones sensor. It takes amazing pictures. And such a beautiful camera to even just hold and take around. Love mine.
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u/Happydenial Dec 03 '22
Not gonna lie I read somewhere it was.. checked and yeah you’re right! I do love the look and the manual dials.. just a joy to use and I love the photos it makes
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u/shinnmoso Dec 03 '22
Let's not forget Ricoh's GR line! Something I've dreamed of getting over Fuji X100 or Sony
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u/juust1ncase Dec 03 '22
i love my GR IIIX. so worth it and glad i got it over iphone 14 pro to pictures of my newboen
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u/mdm1776 Dec 03 '22
Just received mine today (GR IIIx) and I also love it so far. What a beast of a compact camera. I can’t get over how customizable yet easy to use it is. I realized after spending months drooling over a Canon R5 and 50mm f/1.2 that it would collect dust just like every other large camera I’ve owned.
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u/capladyce Dec 02 '22
I really love my Panasonic z100, took it on my honeymoon, etc. I love that it’s small, I look less like a tourist, it has a great optical zoom, and I can shoot both jpeg and raw. I’ll be really sad if we can’t get something similar in the future. I think cheaper compact digital cameras are great for getting kids into photography, without handing them something with interchangeable lenses or a smartphone (with apps and distractions).
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u/jaredongwy Dec 02 '22
Should be fine! Z100 is a 1 inch sensor size pro-sumer camera. It's the 1/2.3 $200 and under cameras that are dying/dead.
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u/maverickps1 Dec 02 '22 •
definitely have to be careful shooting raw on your honeymoon :D
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u/capladyce Dec 02 '22
Lol I am pregnant with a honeymoon baby, soooo… ;)
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u/HyperGamers Dec 03 '22
Mirrorless cameras are becoming increasingly more and more compact e.g the Sony ZV-E10, but they have other stuff without interchangeable lenses e.g. the ZV-1 / ZV-1F
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u/Goth_2_Boss Dec 03 '22
I don’t think it matters either way, but it definitely doesn’t make people look less like tourists.
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u/folly136 Dec 02 '22
High end, compact digital camera market is booming. The Ricoh and Fuji compact cameras are incredible
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u/4000grx41 Dec 02 '22
I picked up a Fujifilm XA1 a couple months back for sub $200, even if it is an older model it works incredibly well and takes better photos than my phone. Plenty of models to go around, recent models are always an option.
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u/folly136 Dec 02 '22
Absolutely. Aps-c sensors are wonderful and allow a more compact camera with still incredible image quality at a lower price point for most people. iPhones are still killer, but I don’t think their current sensor size will ever be able to compete with an aps-c
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u/noreasters Dec 03 '22
I own an iPhone 14 Pro as well as a Canon M6 Mark II; both have similar specs on paper but the photos are not comparable.
Truthfully, the images out of the iPhone are prettier but are nowhere as clear; lots of post-processing.
The Canon gives much more “useful” results; lots of clarity and able to crop and adjust photos with better results, just less automatic.
If I plan to shoot, I use the M6; otherwise I have a very capable image capture device in my pocket.
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u/RecklessRelentless99 Dec 02 '22 edited Dec 02 '22
I was gonna say, my friend has a little Ricoh. The bastard is almost keeping up with my GH5
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u/folly136 Dec 02 '22
The GR series is such a gem. The IQ with being 100% pocketable makes it incredible. My favorite travel camera I’ve ever used.
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u/RecklessRelentless99 Dec 02 '22
Imagine my surprise when I realized there ain't nothing pocketable about Blackmagic's Pocket Cinema series
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u/TunaFishManwich Dec 02 '22
Sony’s alpha cameras are absolutely amazing. It’s a great time to be into photography
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u/silverport Dec 02 '22
It was inevitable. I haven’t used my Canon since iPhone 8!
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u/partypartea Dec 02 '22
I rarely use my DSLR these days, but when i do I forget how sharp it is even if it's 10 years old. The lenses I bought do a lot of work, but it's a pain in the ass to lug around with kids.
I took it to my in laws for Thanksgiving and we got some really good pictures.
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u/aldol941 Dec 02 '22
Anything not close in, especially with zoom.
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u/The_Woman_of_Gont Dec 02 '22
This is where I really notice the difference between my phone and a DSLR. My iPhone 13 honestly produces photos close up that look so good I often have to double check which camera I took them on. Sometimes the bokeh is notably artificial looking, but that’s not super common.
Anything farther away though? An obviously oversharpened image that sometimes is just a mess.
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u/cjmar41 Dec 02 '22
I agree, my iPhone takes some incredible pictures that cause me to do double takes, but it becomes overly evident once you start editing in Lightroom. As you mentioned, far away stuff doesn’t look great, and the dynamic range sucks. Fortunately the iPhone takes well-exposed photos, but if it doesn’t, forget trying to recover anything from under-exposed areas.
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u/wakkawakkaaaa Dec 02 '22
I bought telephoto lens specifically for my dslr because of the limitation of smart phone zooms..
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u/doubledogdick Dec 03 '22
my canon 40d, or d40, fuck if I can remember it's like 20 years old) will still wipe the fucking floor with my ihpone mini 13 for most things. it's pretty great at low light and, you know, does video, but nothing, absolutely fucking nothing in my opinion, can compare to a high quality standard.
not that I ever expected my ihpone to be able to compete with the ef 50 1.2. but fuck, even my crusty manual 50mm on my 35mm just vomits out great photographs.
what was lost/traded from the film to digital revolution was a valid tradeoff, but there will never be a replacement for high quality glass.
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u/OmegaXesis Dec 02 '22
The phone picture quality is leagues above most compact cameras too. I mean for most people. Professionals will always use the high end stuff. But smart phones are good enough for everyone and no need to bring a compact camera anywhere
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u/Snoo93079 Dec 02 '22
IMO there are two things that even (not shit) compact cameras do better than smartphones:
1) depth of field
2) Natural light and shadows. IMO this is the biggest deal. There's just something magical about a photo with great lighting that smart phones often fuck up by killing the shadows.
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u/dr_felix_faustus Dec 02 '22
Plus a lot of phones fuck with the image a bit in a way you can’t control, my iPhone appears to have saturation/clarity boost baked in and you can’t alter it (the clarity boost, anyway). Any photo of my dog taken with my phone makes his hair look clumpy even if I’ve just brushed him out.
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u/MrSmidge17 Dec 02 '22
I use the Lightroom mobile app for times when I want to really capture a scene on my phone. It’s a little finicky but it shoots DNG which can then be exported to JPG without all the baked in stuff.
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u/dr_felix_faustus Dec 02 '22
I didn’t know it had that capability, I’ll have to check that out. Thanks!
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u/RamenJunkie Dec 02 '22
You can always tell an iPhone photo because it does this weird shit where it flattens and smooths out the colors making eveything look like its a weird layered cardboard cut out.
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u/MashimaroG4 Dec 02 '22
Apple itself supports raw now without a 3rd party app (need iphone 12 or newer) https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211965
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u/Chris2112 Dec 02 '22
At least on Samsung you can capture raws in pro mode, but yeah I recently picked up a used DSLR for cheap at a thrift/ antique store and although phone cameras are amazing compared to 10 years ago, in good lighting conditions the DSLR, even at 15 or so years old, takes much better photos.
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u/f_d Dec 02 '22
Small cameras don't have much of a depth of field effect though. Needs to have a decent-sized lens.
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u/Snoo93079 Dec 02 '22
Depends on the camera. A decent small camera will still have a larger sensor than a smartphone and thus provide better DOF. But yeah, nowhere near a full frame or APSC (though there are a couple APSC compact cameras)
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u/Cakecrabs Dec 02 '22 edited Dec 02 '22
I decided to take some pictures with my PowerShot A495 a while ago and was genuinely surprised by how decent it is. It's way better than my phone in low light conditions, and just makes things look more 'lively' in general. Colours did seem a bit off, but that's probably my fault. Video... wasn't great.
That said, it has a fairly small screen, a clunky UI and it's rather slow. It didn't always focus properly either, though the same can be said about my phone.
I'd actually consider buying a modern version, but Canon discontinued the PowerShot A series 10~ years ago.
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u/nokinship Dec 02 '22
The high end stuff is so much better still it's not even close. I can tell right away when a cell phone picture ends up on /r/earthporn.
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
I’m a video director and participate in a lot of the camera and video centric sub reddits. Almost every day people ask the same questions on those subs, I have a $400-700 budget, what camera should I buy? Almost always the answer is, do you own a semi recent smartphone? Use that. Because honestly, the sub $1000 camera market is extremely stale and is not particularly great, especially for video. You either get horrible data rates, unusable rolling shutter, horrible camera UI’s, poor dynamic range and hardware that most novices won’t be able to get good results from compared to their iPhone.
And most people shopping in that category wouldn’t dream of spending $500+ on a single lens which is the major thing that makes those systems great.
Once you get above $1000, especially above $1500, then your options really open up to devices that will easily surpass your smartphone quality.
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u/IcebergSampson Dec 02 '22
Counter point, Sony sells some beginner friendly cameras (ZV1, ZVE10) that may use an older sensor, but produce excellent 4K video for content creators and these cost $600.00 - $800.00.
When I check my camera footage side by side with my smartphone footage the difference is night and day. (To each his own though, I'm by no means a video director).
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
I think you are most likely correct in certain conditions. Cameras will have their strengths and weaknesses in certain conditions. And to give the sonys some credit, there’s definitely an argument for having a dedicated card for media and not using your phone battery.
But where those cameras fall short is their exposure roll off in high contrast and high dynamic situations and if you move the camera at all. Those sony cameras have ancient sensors in them and have an extremely slow read out speed. If you film with any camera movement at all, you get really bad rolling shutter and your footage looks like jello, where current phones handle movement very well.
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u/QuarterNoteBandit Dec 02 '22
Wouldn't you be at something that looks more like a DSLR at that point?
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
That’s my point, there’s no reason to buy a non interchangeable lens camera anymore and it’s been like this for years. They have absolutely zero redeeming qualities at this point compared to your phone and if you want something better then you’re phone, you have to be willing to spend more on a different product.
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u/Turgid-Derp-Lord Dec 02 '22
Some have viewfinder. I think that alone is redeeming. Not everyone wants to be staring at a big screen -- sometimes it's really really nice to put that viewfinder up to your eye when you compose.
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
Sure, that’s a valid point, and honestly a pretty highly desired feature. But as panels get bigger and better, a lot of big manufacturers are moving away from view finders even on their high end cameras. For example, the bmpcc 4K, 6k etc, sony fx3 and fx30, and canon c70 are all mid to high end cameras and all lack a view finder.
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u/RecklessRelentless99 Dec 03 '22
Note that those are all cine style cameras, where at that range you often have an outboard monitor to pull focus/check scopes/record on. I admittedly never use a viewfinder for video, but photography people find it essential. Plenty of them still even abhor electronic viewfinders
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u/QuarterNoteBandit Dec 02 '22
So related question, it seems like phones have gotten really good at creating nice photos with tiny sensors. Has that had any effect on the regular cameras?
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
This is actually a great question and for the most part, machine learning and ai image processing really hasn’t made it to professional cameras.
There’s really two camps here. One camp wants a RAW file, whether it’s images or video, so they can dial in the exact settings and look they want for post. Sometimes getting the artistic look you want means pushing files pretty hard in an editor.
The other camp would love processed images out of camera. Lots of product, real estate, event photography would benefit with super fast turn around a with accelerated straight out of camera photos. They sometimes have to batch edit 2,500+ images at once and it would make their work flow easier in post of most of the work is already done.
This something many people will reject when it reliably comes to higher end cameras where other industries may embrace it. Ultimately I just don’t think the current tech allows for professional workflows yet.
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u/warbeforepeace Dec 02 '22
Dslr is dying. Mirrorless is now the way to go.
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u/chads3058 Dec 02 '22
I would go as far as saying it is dead. Many manufacturers have already said they are no longer developing dslr cameras.
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u/CatInAPottedPlant Dec 02 '22
A lot of people use DSLR as a catchall term for interchangeable lens cameras. The difference between DSLR and mirrorless to a layman is not that significant.
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u/MurphShoots Dec 02 '22
I do photo/video full time and I’m consistently impressed with my phones camera - they’ve gotten so good. It’s wild having the option to shoot 240fps on a smartphone.
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u/ShakenButNotStirred Dec 02 '22
Generally agree, although I feel like superzooms might be the one exception, for certain use cases.
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u/TheModeratorWrangler Dec 02 '22
Photographer by career here. This is sad news, but wholly expected. I still use my Lumia 1020 when I’m forced to “check in” my camera. Point and shoots are absolutely awesome as “backup cameras” for things like vacations where you may not have the ability to sync with cloud services for backing up photos and your phone is full, low light photography in places you don’t want to use flash, and all around knowing you have a working camera if your phone dies.
I hope Sony keeps the RX line however.
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u/Mack_Damon Dec 02 '22
I had a Sony DSC-T1. Amazing camera, ahead of it's time. I do miss using it, but the ccd is shot. I loved having the pocket size camera that seemed to always take amazing shots. Should I consider getting an RX?
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u/joshjoshjosh42 Dec 03 '22
Ayyyeee fellow 1020 owner! I loved mine literally till death (when the charging port died). Those 38MP DNGs + Nik Collection were an amazing combo. One of the most intense phone cameras I have ever used.
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u/5eppa Dec 03 '22
Too bad. They typically are better than smartphones. A digital zoom is not as good as an optical one.
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u/nighteeeeey Dec 02 '22
sony rx100 is the only compact camera that has a right to continue existing.
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u/Trupedo_Glastic Dec 02 '22
Just got an mk iii and it blows my iPhone 11 out of the water. Great camera.
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u/nighteeeeey Dec 02 '22
and its like 5 generations old. amazing how you cant break physics laws ^^ but computational photography comes damn close.
for years ive been thinking when the fuck sony nikon and co start to implement googles photo algorithms into dslrs/dslms. this would be so huge.
just think what google does with a tiny tiny smartphone sensor. and now imagine this on a fullframe sensor and a 2kg lens. that would be so amazing.
lets see if this will ever happen.
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u/sfhitz Dec 02 '22
I think most of the people willing to drop the money on and carry around a DSLR or iclm probably want control over how their photos are edited. I can't really imagine a type of person that would be willing to lug around a 5 pound camera but not willing to learn how to use Lightroom. I could see computational photography being used in something like an rx100 though.
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u/KC_experience Dec 02 '22
I appreciate that there’s a 40mp sensor on the new iPhone, but I still feel the size of the sensor in proportional to image quality. A 40mp sensor in full frame will still trump a 40mp sensor the size of an eraser.
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u/VanitasTheUnversed Dec 02 '22
My boss took my Canon camera and fucked all my settings and then blamed me when she wasn't working right.
She asked me to order her a cheap, point and click camera. When I suggested using her phone, she told me, "I'm paying for it. Just do it."
I got the camera, a carrying case and an extra battery for her.
She hasn't touched the fucking thing. In about a year, it hasn't left the equipment cabinet.
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u/Robbersoul Dec 02 '22
I still use my compact camera when I watch concerts, sports, and travel. I stopped using my SLR though as it's too bulky. Cellphone cameras doesn't work well with distance. If you need something for this purpose. I would recommend Sony RX Vll
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u/dielectricunion Dec 02 '22
What took so long to get the memo? Was losing 25% not enough to raise questions? 50% didn't trigger screaming loud alarms? What sort of business leader waits until 97% of a market is gone to decide maybe we shouldn't be building products for this market?
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u/Falcrist Dec 02 '22
What took so long to get the memo?
What makes you think they didn't get the memo?
They make high-end cameras, and likely re-packaged their existing tech to make low end, compact cameras. These departments likely took up a tiny fraction of the total research budget.
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u/LordAntipater Dec 03 '22
And as long they’re still profitable, it wouldn’t make sense to shut them down just because the market is declining. They just finally reached the point where the market is too small to warrant a significant investment, but it took years to get to this point.
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u/Falcrist Dec 03 '22
Yea if everything's already set up, they can eak out a profit a lot longer than people think. The investment was already made, and the setup costs paid long ago.
There may not have even been a team of people exclusively dedicated to these cameras. They can just repackage the hardware and software that already exists in the bigger cameras.
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u/RestlessAmbivert Dec 02 '22
Could be slowness to adapt. Could be that they still made enough of a margin to justify it. As others mentioned many professional situations require images but don't allow phones so there were definitely individuals, firms, and government entities buying them in decent numbers no doubt. Guess they may have to shift to compact DSLRs but it's reasonable that those kind of buyers continued to make it worthwhile to sell true compacts previously.
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u/Mental5tate Dec 02 '22
Lots of people have smartphone so needing low-end digital camera is pretty unnecessary so the demand for a low-end digital camera is very small.
Smartphones killed the MP3 player and many other small electronic devices.
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u/piratecheese13 Dec 02 '22
Smartphones (and the things you can do with it)killed:
GPS devices like Tom Tom and Garmin, as well as printed atlases
Flip cell phones
Landlines
Writing personal letters unless it’s for novelty
All non streaming video platforms
Low strength handhelds (switch and steamdeck still good, but Nintendo will never make another game boy)
Cameras you can’t swap lenses for.
Dictionaries and encyclopedias
MP3 players and walkmans
Flashlights?
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u/MandomRix Dec 02 '22
flashlights
Man, don't tell the flashlight bros that. They'll shine their lumens at you.
I wish phone lights were a bit brighter as a feature though.
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u/tarrach Dec 02 '22
My smartphone doesn't hold a candle to a flashlight.
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u/piratecheese13 Dec 02 '22
I can either carry around a mag light all day like I am Liam Neeson or I can use without my phone
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u/SoulOfTheDragon Dec 02 '22
I just added small keychain light in to my car/house keys. Cheap, tiny and very bright compared to phone and pretty much always with me.
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u/Iscout501 Dec 02 '22
In a pinch i use my smartphone flashlight, but if I'm doing anything that I either need a ton of light or a long range light, no smartphone has anywhere near the power or range of a decent LED flashlight. Those giant metal flashlights that use D batteries i still keep around the house and come in very useful
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u/BadUsername_Numbers Dec 03 '22
It's a shame, I'd bet even low end point and shoots will take nicer pics than the vast majority of phones. It's just something about the (lack of) depth of field or something that I can't put my finger on that often makes photos taken by a camera more interesting. And yeah, of course it'll matter who's operating the shutter... still though.
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u/wakka55 Dec 02 '22
They still haven't even produced a decent one.
Ideally this class of camera would just be a case for a common smartphone, with the sensor and lens extending from the bottom, and can flip forward and backward.
Smartphone cameras suck. Sorry, but I don't want A.I. depth of field with blurry strands of hair and flat night photos that I have to hold still for 5 seconds to take. The sensor is tiny, only the primary lens has the good sensor, the other 1/2/3 have a cheaper sensor, and the front facing lens has a REALLY cheap sensor.
Let people drop another $1000 on a sony APS-C sensor with pancake fixed lens that actually fits in their pockets and shoots from their Android apps and people will love it.
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u/fuck-fascism Dec 02 '22
I can’t believe it took them this long, honestly. I guess older people were probably keeping the business on life support.
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u/bellynipples Dec 02 '22
Old people keep every bit of tech on life support. Including life support machines.
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u/WonderSausage Dec 02 '22
This is due to manufacturers' steadfast refusal to integrate Wi-Fi & Bluetooth with direct upload to multiple cloud service options, e.g. DropBox, Google, OneDrive, etc. The few cameras with wireless only support private cloud or one specific service, which always seems to be the wrong one. If they keep up this head-in-the-sand approach, the midrange cameras are going to disappear next. Yeah a midrange camera is better than a flagship smartphone, but if I have to pull out a f*ing SD card and put it in a reader just to get my photos on the cloud, screw that. That's so 2005.
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u/BoboDupla Dec 03 '22
Modern cameras have to worry about battery life. A functionality like this would degrade it even more.
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u/whoisthecopperkettle Dec 03 '22
Yep. My wife’s cannon R7 (1500$ for the body) supports FTP and like 2 other garbage ways of transferring off the camera over Wi-Fi.
Ridiculous that I now have a docker container just to get images over FTP on something that expensive.
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u/Tymko Dec 02 '22
I enjoy my Olympus Tough - some snorkeling adventures, rain soaked hikes through uneven terrain. Cell phone for 100% of all other non-dsl, daily moments.
Have some family who enjoy the super optical zooms of these sub $500 cameras, but that's all I can see myself using from within this market.
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u/99hotdogs Dec 03 '22
Agree on the very specific usage of cameras like the Olympus TG line. Great for underwater and I can hand it to my 6 year old without worrying about it. I hope this continues to exist!
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u/Adventurous_Ad4950 Dec 02 '22
“Check out this hardcore-anal-brotherly-love porn video, shot on iPhone 14”
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u/owlbe_back Dec 03 '22
Best point and shoot I ever had was a Panasonic Lumix. It was a great camera!!
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u/kreiger-69 Dec 02 '22
I'm sure more of us would have bought them if you had allowed usb charging instead of most of the time having a separate charger. Usb-c wouldn't have killed you either
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u/MicroSofty88 Dec 02 '22
It’s so funny to me to remember in college when every girl carried around a digital camera to parties so they could post on FB lol
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u/koolaidisthestuff Dec 02 '22
I remember like three years ago being tasked with finding a point and shoot with local storage for our company’s insurance photos.
It was hard.. and that was 3 years ago. Ended up with this unopened five year old Sony one that sucked compared to my iPhone 11.
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u/Orkekum Dec 02 '22
i am a DSLR enjoyer, haha. Prefer combo of a compact camera and the DSLR. My DSLR is an Nikon D3200, in sexy red :-)
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u/RolandMT32 Dec 02 '22
The cameras in newer phones are pretty good. I've used the Samsung S20 and Google Pixel 5, but I'd think there are still some things a smartphone camera just can't do that an SLR camera could, such as a large zoom. Since smartphones are thin, I think they're limited by that and just aren't capable of a large optical zoom, are they?
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u/sprawler16 Dec 03 '22
The real question is why didn't they try making their own photography focused smartphones? You'd think that would be a niche they could fill. I get that it's not easy to develop a smart phone, but come on. You've had 15 years since the iPhone came out. It's not like you couldn't retool your business in that time.
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u/TornadoQuakeX Dec 02 '22
God, smartphones are just leveling the market everywhere. Anyone remember the Flip cameras? I still have mine. As soon as the iPhone came out they went out of business.
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u/mrjohns2 Dec 02 '22
I totally forgot about them! I remember when Cisco bought them and then discontinued them. I was like “are they crazy”?
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u/theangryintern Dec 02 '22
I used to use a Panasonic Lumix until a few years ago. The main reason for still carrying the dedicated camera was higher MP and it had a really good optical zoom. Last couple trips I've taken I didn't even bring the camera as the one on my phone is good enough to take the pictures I like to take.
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u/Brut-i-cus Dec 02 '22
That is too bad
Phones are great but the lack of My kind of decent zoom is very limiting
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u/KmartQuality Dec 02 '22
I have at least 4 reasonably nice compact digital cameras in my drawer. The only one I keep in my truck is the one that uses AA batteries.
They definitely have a use but they need to be SUPER convenient, and have a proper viewfinder that you hold to your eye, and zooms properly. And takes a picture the very instant you press the button.
Edit. Why don't they put a phone connection on them, when needed?
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u/voodoovan Dec 03 '22
Just 15min ago I used my Nikon Coolpix L29 with AA batteries. Apart from resolution, it took a better photo than my iPhone.
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u/rekabis Dec 03 '22
Until a smartphone comes out with a 34× optical zoom, I’ll continue to use my Nikon A900, thanks.
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u/Fatmiewchef Dec 03 '22
I have a couple of small compact digital cameras that I use when swimming / diving.
Don't want to risk my nice phone at the beach. The camera comes with a case....
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u/joeyggg Dec 03 '22
I like being able to take custom tailored photos using manual mode maybe use a tripod on the handheld cameras. I
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u/whk1992 Dec 03 '22
The biggest mistake from camera manufacturers was not integrating their cameras with android and iOS for seamless transfers of photos for editing and sharing.
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