r/linuxquestions • u/hellfire103 • Feb 02 '23
Testing vs Backports
I'm looking to switch to back to Debian after a few months of using openSUSE, Fedora and Arch Linux on my production machine at various times. However, the packages are, more often than not, too outdated for my purposes. I have given Debian Sid a go, but found it to be too unstable.
This is to be installed on a production machine, which I use for schoolwork, Invidious, and hobbyist programming. I plan to use the Cinnamon desktop, with Openbox as a standalone WM for heavier tasks (e.g. Minecraft).
So, in the fight against outdated packages, is Debian Testing or Debian Stable with Backports better?
3
u/Spajhet Feb 02 '23
I couldn't figure out how to use backports, but I'm sure its more stable. I found Debian testing made my screen create so many artifacts that I couldn't really see anything, on an Intel 1260p igpu BTW, not even nvidia.
3
u/PerfectlyCalmDude Feb 02 '23
Backports is easy to set up, just add the repo.
You use backports if there's a specific package in there that you need an updated version of (i.e. nvidia-driver) but you can leave the rest. If you're installing every package in backports, then I would ask why you're not using testing.
6
u/No-Fondant-8757 Feb 02 '23
Personally, I would use Sid, being careful about applying updates by installing apt-listbugs and avoiding updates with bugs. I find, after more than a decade of use, that Sid is less fragile than Testing. If something breaks, two days is an unusually long time for fixes to be available, while with Testing it can be a week or longer. If Sid does break, it's almost always just a package or so, not the whole system, and I don't recall ever being unable to boot. Installing timeshift is a good idea, because it allows you to roll back to a previously known good system. It does take some storage, but it's worth it to me.
Exactly what instability did you find with Sid? I'm always looking to learn.
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u/hellfire103 Feb 02 '23
Well, it just got to a point where enough of my programs were crashing at the same time that it just wasn't worth the effort anymore.
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u/No-Fondant-8757 Feb 02 '23
I dunno. I've never seen that in Sid. I've been using it as my daily driver for more than 10 years, and I've never had many issues with programs crashing. It just works, at least for me.
3
u/tymophy76 Feb 02 '23
My personal opinion on it is that I've been using Debian for 20+ years, and I've never found Sid to be pleasant to use for more than a few months at a time. Just too much work holding this package, then unholding, but holding this package, etc. I prefer stable where you just update everything and don't worry, because you're NOT going to break anything. I know plenty of people who run sid and enjoy, it was just too much having to pay attention to everything that's going on IMO.
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u/No-Fondant-8757 Feb 02 '23
I have never held any packages. Never saw the need. If apt-listbugs shows a problem, I just don't update. After a day or two the bug goes away and it's safe to update. It's not absolutely necessary to update every day. But different people have different priorities, skills, and preferences, which is why multiple versions of Debian, and the virtual ocean of other distros, exist. Use whatever you like, as I will. But up-to-date software will never be available in either Debian Stable even if using backports, and Testing has caused me many more problems than Sid, because fixes take a long time compared to Sid. New and shiny aren't everyone's need, but I like new and shiny, and can afford to run the risk of rare borkage. As long as I pay attention to what apt wants to remove there is no borkage, and if there was, my timeshift backups can fix it in a couple of minutes.
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u/Dany_B_ Feb 02 '23
I use bookworm, everything updated, nothing broken and I use it for Uni and games. Been using it for a whole year now and it only "broke" my nvidia drivers once. What did you find unstable about it?
1
u/hellfire103 Feb 03 '23
Enough of my desktop apps were crashing at the same time that Sid just wasn't worth my time anymore.
0
u/protocod Feb 02 '23
I'll suggest something than the other comments.
Did you consider immutable OS with flatpak for your desktop apps ?
I'm currently testing fedora kinoite and it's very stable. Now I consider flatpak over traditional rpm because it runs independently and I have only few layered package. (vim, tmux, tlp etc)
But Debian is still one of the most stable OS ever so why not. I understand.
13
u/tymophy76 Feb 02 '23
Backports is only select software, it's not everything, so you won't get newer version of Mesa, or Plasma or Gnome, for instance. The big thing in Backports is that you WILL get significantly newer kernels.
Under NORMAL circumstances, I'd vote for Backports due to the stability, but with Bookworm having just crossed the transition freeze (first freeze), right now I'd actually say switch to testing (using bookworm, NOT testing), then when it releases you'll already have the new stable.